Author Topic: another week, another mass shooting in the USA  (Read 11207 times)

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Offline larrylove

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #180 on: December 17, 2012, 12:16:20 PM »
all those innocent people,there should be no guns at all....

Offline Maximus

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #181 on: December 17, 2012, 12:17:46 PM »
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My question to you and all other Christians is, would Jesus be in favor of legal guns? I'm pretty confident I know what the answer is

I'm pretty confident that Jesus would be in favour of a ban on abortion but unborn children are just a bunch of cells to some people aren't they?

I agree that Jesus would want abortions banned, just like he would want guns banned.

If we could magically take away every gun in the world--if all firearms in the world were outlawed I would be for it. The facts remain we don't live in a fairy world where crime doesn't exist, where the bad guys don't have guns and we do need to protect our family.

TUC stated earlier a article from MOJO that nobody used a gun to stop the recent mass killings, That article doesn't make any sense to me, because that is irrelevant. How many guns have driven criminals off. How can killing have been stopped. I can tell you about one right now in my phone town. A ex con went into the lawyers office to rob and kill the lawyers who he thought put him in jail. He lined up 6 of them face down on he ground. When one of them (a good friend of mine) rolled over and shot the perp, the perp shot back hitting my friend in both arms luckily my friend was carrying a .45 and it blew the guys hand off, he ran (latter caught by the Police) bottom line, had Justin not been carrying a pistol all six of them would have died. So there you go, was that televised; no because it was not a sensational news story.

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« Last Edit: December 17, 2012, 12:30:32 PM by Maximus »

Offline Maximus

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #182 on: December 17, 2012, 12:52:29 PM »
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The two things aren't mutually exclusive.

You can definitely say 'address the gun problem' and 'address mental health'.

The gun lobby would rather hear you say 'guns aren't the problem, you need to leave all that as it is and look at mental health'.

Isn't society intelligent enough to try and do both?

Gun Crimes are the symptoms not the disease. I would ask is it more tragic that 26 people die at once or is it more tragic that 27 people are stabbed in say Manchester-a death is a death and just because it happens all at once it is more horrific, not more tragic, just more news worthy.

In assaults involving force, sexual incidents, burglary and motor vehicle thefts, Australia ranked highest of all countries surveyed

Since it is apparent that Aussies don't know how to use there tallywackers should we ban them?

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Anyway you know I was being silly, but I am making a larger point there is a problem in society, what is causing the rash of copy cat massacres. What is wrong with our youth, I don't know

which figure in that report do you think shows oz as the highest? simple answer for this one thanks. i couldnt find anything that reflected what you say is all and am worried your imaginative interpretation of words and numbers might be giving us a bum steer. admittedly i only scanned through.

and then there was this....

Summary and Conclusions

Australia is a relatively high risk country as far as crime is concerned as this cross-national survey indicates. Happily, we are not in the same league as the USA.....


seems an odd conclusion if what you say is true. well looking forward to what figure/table etc those stats come from anyway.

then again it could all just be a desperate (and inaccurate?) lash out at another country to try and feel better about the massive problem within your own. i'd avoid that. it may make you briefly feel better but its not really a long term solution to the problem you have there.

If you read the whole article it states that AU has higher levels of sexual assault, burglary and car theft pc than the US. Luckily you guys don't have guns.

A lot of my fellow offices (when stationed in Korea) would go down to Australia when on leave. The comment was it was very easy to meet girls there because they liked Americans, because one we were a lot nicer to them than Australians, two we weren't going to rape them, three there wasn't a whole lot of competition because Aus has a lot of homosexuals. Just what my friends told me. (I have never been there) However we did have Australian officers in my officer training class, and they were extremely aggressive with our female officers to a point where our females were told to stay away from them and do not drink with them. The Brits were fine, as were the other foreign officers. However I know for a fact that an Australian major was sent home for sexual misconduct/harassment.

Some interesting topics:

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Crime Statistics > Rapes (per capita)(most recent) by country
VIEW DATA: Totals Per capita
Definition Source Printable version

Showing latest available data. Rank Countries Amount (top to bottom)
#1 South Africa: 1.19538 per 1,000 people
#2 Seychelles: 0.788294 per 1,000 people
#3 Australia: 0.777999 per 1,000 people

Assaults per C

Rank      Countries     Amount
# 1   Saint Kitts and Nevis:    3%   
# 2    United Kingdom:    2.8%     
= 3   New Zealand:    2.4%     
= 3   Australia:    2.4%
# 5   Canada:    2.3%     
# 6   Finland:    2.1%
= 7   France:    1.4%     
= 7   Denmark: 1.4%     
= 9   Sweden:    1.2%     
= 9   United States:    1.2%     
= 9   Belgium:    1.2%     
Assault victims by country", UNICRI (United Nations Interregional Crime and Justice Research Institute). Correspondence on data on crime victims. March. Turin.

So when an Aussie tells me I need to ban my weapon, I think they should ban their "guns"
« Last Edit: December 17, 2012, 12:56:43 PM by Maximus »

Online briscoetheque

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #183 on: December 17, 2012, 01:36:30 PM »
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My question to you and all other Christians is, would Jesus be in favor of legal guns? I'm pretty confident I know what the answer is

I'm pretty confident that Jesus would be in favour of a ban on abortion but unborn children are just a bunch of cells to some people aren't they?

And there it is folks...

Offline JTBaby

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #184 on: December 17, 2012, 01:44:25 PM »
Ok who came closest to "alispnfan at 10.34am" ?

Online briscoetheque

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #185 on: December 17, 2012, 02:07:23 PM »
Ah maximus. So good to have you in here.

Many have missed your apples and oranges googling skills. I know I have.

And the anecdotal tales of Australians being rapists was truly heartwarming.

Guns aren't the problem. Guns aren't the problem. Guns aren't the problem.

Offline Droo

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #186 on: December 17, 2012, 02:25:19 PM »
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If we could magically take away every gun in the world--if all firearms in the world were outlawed I would be for it. The facts remain we don't live in a fairy world where crime doesn't exist, where the bad guys don't have guns and we do need to protect our family.

Um, pretty sure we have crime here too, bro. After all, it is my job to defend those accused of crimes.

We don't have anywhere near the same level of national obsession with guns, and gun violence is far more rare here than down there. Why, I haven't been shot once! Hard to be believe, but it's totes true! Amazing, right?

Guns are unnecessary to defend oneself against crime.

Offline Maximus

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #187 on: December 17, 2012, 02:26:45 PM »
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Ah maximus. So good to have you in here.

Many have missed your apples and oranges googling skills. I know I have.

And the anecdotal tales of Australians being rapists was truly heartwarming.

Guns aren't the problem. Guns aren't the problem. Guns aren't the problem.

well the UN crime stats say you have the 3rd highest rape case's per capita.

But Brisco I like you you are a good dude--I am trying to make a point, that guns don't commit the crimes anymore than the weapon of choice down under it is the criminal mind that is the problem. Wisdom from Conan:

"Steel isn't strong, boy. Flesh is stronger. Look around you." Thulsa motions to some of the thousands of followers surrounding his mountain who worship him as the mouthpiece of God. He points up to the top of a cliff, "There, on the rocks, that beautiful girl." He motions to the girl, "Come to me, my child." The girl steps off the cliff and falls to her death. "That is strength, boy. That is power: the strength and power of flesh. What is steel compared to the hand that wields it? Look at the strength of your body, the desire in your heart. I give you this ...such a waste. Contemplate this on the tree of woe. Crucify him."

You see just as in the riddle of steel--the sword wasn't strong it is the mind- the sword by itself is useless-

Or wisdom from full metal jacket:

Your rifle is only a tool. It is a hard heart that kills.

Offline Maximus

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #188 on: December 17, 2012, 02:28:13 PM »
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If we could magically take away every gun in the world--if all firearms in the world were outlawed I would be for it. The facts remain we don't live in a fairy world where crime doesn't exist, where the bad guys don't have guns and we do need to protect our family.

Guns are unnecessary to defend oneself against crime.

did you read the articles I posted, I disagree

I could agree on banning assault rifles and high cap magazines though
« Last Edit: December 17, 2012, 02:29:57 PM by Maximus »

Offline Droo

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #189 on: December 17, 2012, 02:30:40 PM »
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If we could magically take away every gun in the world--if all firearms in the world were outlawed I would be for it. The facts remain we don't live in a fairy world where crime doesn't exist, where the bad guys don't have guns and we do need to protect our family.

Guns are unnecessary to defend oneself against crime.

did you read the articles I posted, I disagree

Well, damn, I guess I'm just going to have to direct your articles to the massive number of people who I know up here who don't own guns and have never been victimized or threatened with violence as irrefutable proof that we are all in grave danger! D:

Hold me. Imma scurred. :'( 

Offline soapit

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #190 on: December 17, 2012, 02:51:54 PM »
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The two things aren't mutually exclusive.

You can definitely say 'address the gun problem' and 'address mental health'.

The gun lobby would rather hear you say 'guns aren't the problem, you need to leave all that as it is and look at mental health'.

Isn't society intelligent enough to try and do both?

Gun Crimes are the symptoms not the disease. I would ask is it more tragic that 26 people die at once or is it more tragic that 27 people are stabbed in say Manchester-a death is a death and just because it happens all at once it is more horrific, not more tragic, just more news worthy.

In assaults involving force, sexual incidents, burglary and motor vehicle thefts, Australia ranked highest of all countries surveyed

Since it is apparent that Aussies don't know how to use there tallywackers should we ban them?

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Anyway you know I was being silly, but I am making a larger point there is a problem in society, what is causing the rash of copy cat massacres. What is wrong with our youth, I don't know

which figure in that report do you think shows oz as the highest? simple answer for this one thanks. i couldnt find anything that reflected what you say is all and am worried your imaginative interpretation of words and numbers might be giving us a bum steer. admittedly i only scanned through.

and then there was this....

Summary and Conclusions

Australia is a relatively high risk country as far as crime is concerned as this cross-national survey indicates. Happily, we are not in the same league as the USA.....


seems an odd conclusion if what you say is true. well looking forward to what figure/table etc those stats come from anyway.

then again it could all just be a desperate (and inaccurate?) lash out at another country to try and feel better about the massive problem within your own. i'd avoid that. it may make you briefly feel better but its not really a long term solution to the problem you have there.

If you read the whole article it states that AU has higher levels of sexual assault, burglary and car theft pc than the US. Luckily you guys don't have guns.

A lot of my fellow offices (when stationed in Korea) would go down to Australia when on leave. The comment was it was very easy to meet girls there because they liked Americans, because one we were a lot nicer to them than Australians, two we weren't going to rape them, three there wasn't a whole lot of competition because Aus has a lot of homosexuals. Just what my friends told me. (I have never been there) However we did have Australian officers in my officer training class, and they were extremely aggressive with our female officers to a point where our females were told to stay away from them and do not drink with them. The Brits were fine, as were the other foreign officers. However I know for a fact that an Australian major was sent home for sexual misconduct/harassment.

Some interesting topics:

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Crime Statistics > Rapes (per capita)(most recent) by country
VIEW DATA: Totals Per capita
Definition Source Printable version

Showing latest available data. Rank Countries Amount (top to bottom)
#1 South Africa: 1.19538 per 1,000 people
#2 Seychelles: 0.788294 per 1,000 people
#3 Australia: 0.777999 per 1,000 people

Assaults per C

Rank      Countries     Amount
# 1   Saint Kitts and Nevis:    3%   
# 2    United Kingdom:    2.8%     
= 3   New Zealand:    2.4%     
= 3   Australia:    2.4%
# 5   Canada:    2.3%     
# 6   Finland:    2.1%
= 7   France:    1.4%     
= 7   Denmark: 1.4%     
= 9   Sweden:    1.2%     
= 9   United States:    1.2%     
= 9   Belgium:    1.2%     
Assault victims by country", UNICRI (United Nations Interregional Crime and Justice Research Institute). Correspondence on data on crime victims. March. Turin.

So when an Aussie tells me I need to ban my weapon, I think they should ban their "guns"


so it didnt say we were the "highest of all countries surveyed" after all. was it an error you made or did you intentionally make it up?

given your history you should just take it as given at this point that your "facts" will be checked. best to avoid the embarrassment of having to backtrack in future and just not make things up in the first place.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2012, 02:54:22 PM by soapit »

Offline Maximus

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #191 on: December 17, 2012, 02:58:47 PM »
I
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The two things aren't mutually exclusive.

You can definitely say 'address the gun problem' and 'address mental health'.

The gun lobby would rather hear you say 'guns aren't the problem, you need to leave all that as it is and look at mental health'.

Isn't society intelligent enough to try and do both?

Gun Crimes are the symptoms not the disease. I would ask is it more tragic that 26 people die at once or is it more tragic that 27 people are stabbed in say Manchester-a death is a death and just because it happens all at once it is more horrific, not more tragic, just more news worthy.

In assaults involving force, sexual incidents, burglary and motor vehicle thefts, Australia ranked highest of all countries surveyed

Since it is apparent that Aussies don't know how to use there tallywackers should we ban them?

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Anyway you know I was being silly, but I am making a larger point there is a problem in society, what is causing the rash of copy cat massacres. What is wrong with our youth, I don't know

which figure in that report do you think shows oz as the highest? simple answer for this one thanks. i couldnt find anything that reflected what you say is all and am worried your imaginative interpretation of words and numbers might be giving us a bum steer. admittedly i only scanned through.

and then there was this....

Summary and Conclusions

Australia is a relatively high risk country as far as crime is concerned as this cross-national survey indicates. Happily, we are not in the same league as the USA.....


seems an odd conclusion if what you say is true. well looking forward to what figure/table etc those stats come from anyway.

then again it could all just be a desperate (and inaccurate?) lash out at another country to try and feel better about the massive problem within your own. i'd avoid that. it may make you briefly feel better but its not really a long term solution to the problem you have there.

If you read the whole article it states that AU has higher levels of sexual assault, burglary and car theft pc than the US. Luckily you guys don't have guns.

A lot of my fellow offices (when stationed in Korea) would go down to Australia when on leave. The comment was it was very easy to meet girls there because they liked Americans, because one we were a lot nicer to them than Australians, two we weren't going to rape them, three there wasn't a whole lot of competition because Aus has a lot of homosexuals. Just what my friends told me. (I have never been there) However we did have Australian officers in my officer training class, and they were extremely aggressive with our female officers to a point where our females were told to stay away from them and do not drink with them. The Brits were fine, as were the other foreign officers. However I know for a fact that an Australian major was sent home for sexual misconduct/harassment.

Some interesting topics:

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

Crime Statistics > Rapes (per capita)(most recent) by country
VIEW DATA: Totals Per capita
Definition Source Printable version

Showing latest available data. Rank Countries Amount (top to bottom)
#1 South Africa: 1.19538 per 1,000 people
#2 Seychelles: 0.788294 per 1,000 people
#3 Australia: 0.777999 per 1,000 people

Assaults per C

Rank      Countries     Amount
# 1   Saint Kitts and Nevis:    3%   
# 2    United Kingdom:    2.8%     
= 3   New Zealand:    2.4%     
= 3   Australia:    2.4%
# 5   Canada:    2.3%     
# 6   Finland:    2.1%
= 7   France:    1.4%     
= 7   Denmark: 1.4%     
= 9   Sweden:    1.2%     
= 9   United States:    1.2%     
= 9   Belgium:    1.2%     
Assault victims by country", UNICRI (United Nations Interregional Crime and Justice Research Institute). Correspondence on data on crime victims. March. Turin.

So when an Aussie tells me I need to ban my weapon, I think they should ban their "guns"


so it didnt say we were the "highest of all countries surveyed" after all. was it an error you made or did you intentionally make it up?

given your history you should just take it as given at this point that your "facts" will be checked. best to avoid the embarrassment of having to backtrack in future and just not make things up in the first place.

It was the highest in the australlian study, that only focused on western nations, the UN study was separate.

Offline So Cruel

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #192 on: December 17, 2012, 03:14:08 PM »
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My question to you and all other Christians is, would Jesus be in favor of legal guns? I'm pretty confident I know what the answer is

I'm pretty confident that Jesus would be in favour of a ban on abortion but unborn children are just a bunch of cells to some people aren't they?

I agree that Jesus would want abortions banned, just like he would want guns banned.

If we could magically take away every gun in the world--if all firearms in the world were outlawed I would be for it. The facts remain we don't live in a fairy world where crime doesn't exist, where the bad guys don't have guns and we do need to protect our family.

TUC stated earlier a article from MOJO that nobody used a gun to stop the recent mass killings, That article doesn't make any sense to me, because that is irrelevant. How many guns have driven criminals off. How can killing have been stopped. I can tell you about one right now in my phone town. A ex con went into the lawyers office to rob and kill the lawyers who he thought put him in jail. He lined up 6 of them face down on he ground. When one of them (a good friend of mine) rolled over and shot the perp, the perp shot back hitting my friend in both arms luckily my friend was carrying a .45 and it blew the guys hand off, he ran (latter caught by the Police) bottom line, had Justin not been carrying a pistol all six of them would have died. So there you go, was that televised; no because it was not a sensational news story.

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So you have a point. People should be able to defend their home/family. I do not disagree with you. I am Canadian and I can honestly say that I have never had to consider buying a gun to protect my family, but of course we don't have as many people/nuts with guns here. There is a big part of the problem in the U.S. Because guns are so easy to obtain, it leads to more guns purchased by the common person because they feel the need to protect themselves. It's a vicious cycle.

I think that a fair solution would be that every citizen can have 1 gun. It can only be an old fashioned rifle or an old fashioned 6 shooter pistol. That would be ample protection for your home/family. The guns that are in the public right now can be traded in for the legal firearm. Stiff fines for anyone that keeps the unauthorized firearms.

Online briscoetheque

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #193 on: December 17, 2012, 03:31:02 PM »
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But Brisco I like you you are a good dude

All your arguments have now lost credibility.

Anyone will tell you I'm rubbish.  ;)

Offline soapit

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Re: another week, another mass shooting in the USA
« Reply #194 on: December 17, 2012, 03:32:50 PM »
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It was the highest in the australlian study, that only focused on western nations, the UN study was separate.

still waiting on the figure/table/section reference that actually confirms what you are saying. merely repeating your claim doesnt constitute supporting evidence.

be nice if you've got this one right if only for variety.