Author Topic: The Case for Rattle and Hum  (Read 2641 times)

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Offline shineinthesummernight

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #15 on: December 17, 2016, 10:37:38 PM »
I loved the "Heartland" footage from R and H. 

Offline THRILLHO

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #16 on: December 18, 2016, 10:57:31 AM »
o i love R&H...THIS R&H

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so i tried a new playlist today and it's a big improvement!

VDL <finally got around to editing about 30 seconds of it out, removing the audience clapping at the beginning and the interview crap at the end>
Desire
God p2
Hawk
Sweet Fire of Love <this was the only song i added in and it works GREAT!>
Heartland
ARATHH
AoH
WLCTT
LRM
H[HSC]
AIWIY

Offline il_capo

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #17 on: December 18, 2016, 03:33:33 PM »
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o i love R&H...THIS R&H

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so i tried a new playlist today and it's a big improvement!

VDL <finally got around to editing about 30 seconds of it out, removing the audience clapping at the beginning and the interview crap at the end>
Desire
God p2
Hawk
Sweet Fire of Love <this was the only song i added in and it works GREAT!>
Heartland
ARATHH
AoH
WLCTT
LRM
H[HSC]
AIWIY

There's so much live U2 stuff on youtube now, and if you watch the Zoo TV stuff and The Joshua Tree stuff aside each other it's clear they became a much better band in the early 90s.  Rattle and Hum has some decent tunes on it: Angel of Harlem is good, as is All I Want Is You.  If it'd have been a studio album focusing on their love for mid-c20th American music it might've been more interesting, but the live focus of the film doesn't work for me - I find I don't really like that era of the band very much.  However, it is because of the greatness of the music they produced in the years following R&H that I can look back at the album with a fairly acute sense of disappointment.

Offline Vox

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #18 on: December 19, 2016, 10:13:28 AM »
I listened to the studio tracks again this weekend.  When Rattle and Hum came out, I really enjoyed it.  Then I went away from it once the 90's happened.  I generally list it in the lower part of my U2antheon.  However, putting personal history aside, the studio tracks are pretty solid.  I enjoyed listening to the songs again this past weekend.

I've sort of rediscovered "Hawkmoon" again this year at the beginning of the summer, and that's become a favorite for me.  "Desire" is a good little dirty ditty, and I like that U2 have this song in their repertoire.  I've always enjoyed "Van Dieman's Land," "God Part II," and "Heartland."  I can take or leave "Angel of Harlem," "Love Rescue Me," and "When Loves Comes to Town," personally.  "All I Want Is You" is a good torch song, but not the sort of U2 song I usually gravitate towards.   

And the live songs are good.  I don't know why U2 don't have more official live albums. 

All and all, maybe I've overlooked this album for too long.  However, there are so many other strong U2 albums for it to move up too much in my U2antheon.  I might rate Rattle and Hum above October, How to Dismantle An Atomic Bomb, and Songs of Innocence.  And I like all of those albums, for the most part.  But together, they are in my lower tier of U2 albums.

Offline WookieeWarrior10

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #19 on: December 21, 2016, 10:56:14 PM »
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* The production on that album is better than any other U2 album.  Jimmy Iovine and his team got a powerful, punchy and atmospheric sound that just works for U2.

Of course, this is totally subjective. But Achtung Baby is actually the most well-produced album that I've ever heard, and there isn't much competition (in U2's discography, at least). With the exceptions of this album and maybe Zooropa, OS1, and Pop-- none of their albums are lauded for their production. R&H has no memorable production value, but when listening to any of the aforementioned albums I still hear new things with each listen.

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* Bono's voice is at its absolute peak after ten years of constant touring and recording.  Listen to the three-octave range range of Hawkmoon for evidence.

Hard to argue there. I love Bono's vocals on later albums for the variety... like The Fly, for example (it includes both him singing in a lower register and in falsetto during the choruses). That's only preference though. Technically, he was superior in the 90s, but he did have a more impactful/powerful sound in the 80s.

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* It contains some of their all-time best songs in Desire, Heartland, Angel of Harlem and All I Want is You.  If these had been brought out on an EP it would have been heralded a classic.

I won't disagree and say that R&H doesn't have any memorable songs. God Part II and Heartland are classics. There's something for everybody on this album, which is actually something I dislike... there is a difference between incorporating different styles and genres into an album and just slapping a few random songs together. See NLOTH, for example.

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* The live tracks are well-performed, strong, atmospheric, three-dimensional.  Listen to the start of Bullet The Blue Sky or the sheer power of Pride.

I haven't listened to the live tracks in forever, so I don't have much to say regarding them... but the one that does stick with me is Helter Skelter. It isn't good, and I'm totally aware of that, but it's a fast and fun start that introduces you to the album. U2 could have been better but it serves its purpose.

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* Even the trio of Sun tracks (When Love Comes To Town, Love Rescue Me) contain their own curiously little atmosphere and it was the band being adventurous and trying something different - which we don't get much of these days!

You're right, it is fun to see them experimenting with this genre. Still, we all know that those songs suck!

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* It's the last album where they truly sounded like a band playing together, without clicks tracks, overdubs etc.

I never realized it, but you're kind of right. Sure, some Pop and Zooropa songs are more conventional (Stay and Velvet Dress, maybe...), but R&H was the last album where U2 just jammed and focused on making good songs rather than obsessing over every last detail in the studio. I would love if U2 recorded an album in the style of Blackstar. That album was raw, unpolished, and had attitude. Especially on songs like Sue and 'Tis A Pity..., where Bowie recorded in the same room as the band. (I don't know if that's 100% true, but it sounds right given all of the noises he accidentally makes into the microphone).

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* The final two minutes of All I Want Is You has to be the best (and most heart-breaking) album ending of all all time.

Meh. It's overdone and kind of forced, but to each their own. Surely it's more believable than something like Grace, though!  :)

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I prefer it to the Joshua Tree, War and anything they've done this century.
The Joshua Tree, as overrated as it is, still holds a few amazing songs like Exit that blow anything from R&H out of the water. War sucks, so maybe I could consider placing this over it. It is better than ATYCLB and HTDAAB, I'll agree!

Offline Monicalea

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #20 on: December 22, 2016, 07:18:01 PM »
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Love R&H. It has Hawkmoon on it...'nuff said.

OH HAYUL YEAH!

I actually love the whole album, and always have, but Hawkmoon just does it for me!

Even before certain *ahem* stories.

Offline riffraff

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #21 on: December 23, 2016, 04:31:24 AM »
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Love R&H. It has Hawkmoon on it...'nuff said.

OH HAYUL YEAH!

I actually love the whole album, and always have, but Hawkmoon just does it for me!

I knew you were a smart lady, Mon! Hawkmoon is so intense, and a GREAT workout song. I swear, I play it 3 or 4 times in a row when I'm running. Would sure love to see it live.

LightMyWay92

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #22 on: December 23, 2016, 10:07:21 AM »
For the most part, I feel that the studio tracks on Rattle and Hum are strong ("All I Want is You is a U2 classic IMO), but the live tracks should have been dropped in favor of a few more studio songs.  It would have made more of an impact as an actual album that way.  As it was, it was still very successful for U2.  I've said it before, but until I stop seeing revisionist history, I'll say it again:  the so-called backlash against Rattle and Hum was primarily among music critics (fickle elitists that they are) and not the general public, at least not here in the States.  I remember hearing the singles all over the radio, and the album sold a lot.
« Last Edit: December 23, 2016, 10:09:22 AM by LightMyWay92 »

Offline aviastar

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #23 on: March 16, 2017, 08:37:29 AM »
I am re-listening to R&H right now.

Here's my takeways:

1) Why in the hell did they cover All Along The Watchtower?  Talk about all downside, no upside.  They didn't DO anything with it - Edge didn't even do a rudimentary guitar solo in the spot where Hendrix just made this song his.  Even Dylan pretty much conceded this song to Jimi.

2) Pride - OMG there are serious timing issues with the R&H live version of this song.  I didn't notice it before - haven't listened to this album in full in quite some time.   Right after "One man betrayed with a kiss..." into the chorus...not sure if Bono leads the beat down and the band follows but it shifts from about 112 to 110 BPM and it's noticible.  Also, Larry feels like he is seriously dragging on the snare the entire song.

3) Cringeworthy moments - "Artists against Apartheidddd...", "Ok Edge Play the blues...", "We're stealing it back"...eh, shut it Bono.  I agree with the sentiment, but you sound like an ar*e.

4) Star Spangled Banner, Freedom For my People...why??

5) The Good: really great studio material on this album.  Angel of Harlem, Heartland, Hawkmoon 269, Desire are all great.  When Love Comes to Town is better for BB King than for U2...Bono sounds like he's reaching on some of the vocals.  All I Want Is You is fine.  Van Diemen's Land is what it is.  I could take or leave Love Rescue Me, God Part II.

There is some really good material on R&H.  I think some of the live stuff on it is spotty.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2017, 08:40:33 AM by aviastar »

Offline Canadanne

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2017, 09:54:17 AM »
I looooove their performance of All Along The Watchtower. Easily my favourite version of that song.

Offline Thunder Peel

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2017, 10:55:02 AM »
From the film it's pretty obvious that All Along the Watchtower was something they threw together at the last minute and decided to perform. It's not anything amazing but it's certainly not bad either.

Offline aviastar

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #26 on: March 16, 2017, 11:24:59 AM »
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From the film it's pretty obvious that All Along the Watchtower was something they threw together at the last minute and decided to perform. It's not anything amazing but it's certainly not bad either.

I think that's the point - if they threw it together for a live concert that's one thing.  But putting on the album makes a bit of a statement. i.e. "Here's our take on this American classic".  If it's not a groundbreaking rendition it ends up being just another cover, and completely unremarkable.  That's why I say it's all downside, no upside.  It's a big reason why critics accused them of appropriation and arrogance.

Offline THRILLHO

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #27 on: March 16, 2017, 04:57:21 PM »
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I am re-listening to R&H right now.

Here's my takeways:

1) Why in the hell did they cover All Along The Watchtower?  Talk about all downside, no upside.  They didn't DO anything with it - Edge didn't even do a rudimentary guitar solo in the spot where Hendrix just made this song his.  Even Dylan pretty much conceded this song to Jimi.

2) Pride - OMG there are serious timing issues with the R&H live version of this song.  I didn't notice it before - haven't listened to this album in full in quite some time.   Right after "One man betrayed with a kiss..." into the chorus...not sure if Bono leads the beat down and the band follows but it shifts from about 112 to 110 BPM and it's noticible.  Also, Larry feels like he is seriously dragging on the snare the entire song.

3) Cringeworthy moments - "Artists against Apartheidddd...", "Ok Edge Play the blues...", "We're stealing it back"...eh, shut it Bono.  I agree with the sentiment, but you sound like an ar*e.

4) Star Spangled Banner, Freedom For my People...why??

5) The Good: really great studio material on this album.  Angel of Harlem, Heartland, Hawkmoon 269, Desire are all great.  When Love Comes to Town is better for BB King than for U2...Bono sounds like he's reaching on some of the vocals.  All I Want Is You is fine.  Van Diemen's Land is what it is.  I could take or leave Love Rescue Me, God Part II.

There is some really good material on R&H.  I think some of the live stuff on it is spotty.

oh the SSB intro to BTBS is great! yes the "artists against apartHEID" part always makes me giggle. and "edge play the blues!" *proceeds to play the unbluesiest solo youve ever heard* is funny too

in general i was bored with the amount of full on covers <not just snippets> of songs they did.

yea AIWIY and God part 2 are 2 highlights of the album no question.

Offline miryclay

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #28 on: March 16, 2017, 05:07:02 PM »
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I looooove their performance of All Along The Watchtower. Easily my favourite version of that song.

Neil Young MSG 92 is better

Offline miryclay

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Re: The Case for Rattle and Hum
« Reply #29 on: March 16, 2017, 05:08:48 PM »
Did someone say 'The case of Rattle and Hum'

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