Author Topic: Tedder working with Steve  (Read 5175 times)

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Offline monopoly

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #60 on: March 19, 2017, 02:40:08 PM »
I honestly prefer what some of SOI would have sounded like without Tedder. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login This version of EBW preTedder is a prime example.

Offline MattD

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #61 on: March 19, 2017, 03:32:14 PM »
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U2 aren't a rock band, they are alternative. It'd be like calling Coldplay a rock band. Preposterous. Even if they were, some artists have had a lot of success with producers they normally would not choose. Sometimes a little genre exploration is a good thing and leads to something more creative.

Here's a list of Tedder's credits for anyone interested: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login


Is that the list? You have got to be joe-king! That's appalling modern chart music right there!

Offline xy

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #62 on: March 19, 2017, 04:04:46 PM »
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I honestly prefer what some of SOI would have sounded like without Tedder. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login This version of EBW preTedder is a prime example.

A slightly diffent chorus and a little more guitar. Not exactly worlds apart from the album version, which (nicely) accentuates the synth.

Offline MattD

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #63 on: March 19, 2017, 04:38:05 PM »
Interesting that when Elbow frontman Guy Garvey was asked about the follow up Build A Rocket Boys to their smash hit album Seldom Seen Kid, he was asked about its apparent lack of 'radio-friendliness', stating:

"We could write deliberate radio hits until the cows come home, but I think you can hear it really obviously when a band has done that."

As a result, that Elbow album sounded like a natural development from their arena filling album, and neither sought to replicate it or out do it.

And that really sums up U2 and Ryan Tedder - real music fans can usually tell how hollow and crowd baiting these songs are. Like bubblegum, it's going to taste pleasant but the taste will wear off soon. And that sums up every pop star Tedder has worked with - there's nothing substantial, thought provoking or inherently moving in his tunes. They are not 'artists' - they are great marketers of focus grouped pop that is flimsy beyond belief without any artistic merit. They used to be able to write chart topping anthems, but those days are long gone, and we can all the difference between authenticity and desperation. But that shouldn't deter them. When U2 are themselves, and without the self-conscience that has crippled them and the musical straitjacket that they fit into to desperately appeal to the masses, they are at their best and can still create brilliant music.

Do people really think David Bowie was craving a chart hit when making Blackstar? Of course not, he threw off his inhibitions and made his best album of 25 years. U2 can do this when they want - Moment of Surrender, The Troubles, Sleep Like A Baby Tonight, Cedars of Lebanon, Raised By Wolves (even if the latter is ruined by tinny energy sapping production, the makings of an excellent song is there).

The talent still remains. Of course nobody is expecting a masterpiece like Achtung Baby or The Joshua Tree, but us hardcore fans are still sure that they can go from making merely decent albums to excellent albums. We're not asking for greatness, just something on a level much more subtle and sophisticated with artistic credibility, and certainly less shallow, than their recent offerings. This is U2 after all - us fans expect high standards and if we're not given it, then we have a right to bemoan a once great band resorting to such cheap, tedious, artistically null, bland pop stars like Ryan Tedder.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2017, 10:41:50 AM by MattD »

Offline trevgreg

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #64 on: March 19, 2017, 04:41:22 PM »
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I honestly prefer what some of SOI would have sounded like without Tedder. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login This version of EBW preTedder is a prime example.

The problem there is that this alternate version appears to have been made AFTER Tedder's recommendations.

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Tedder did some of his most radical sur­gery on “Every Breaking Wave,” which had been a lyrical but meandering No Line out­take. “It’s about how hard it is to give your­self completely to another person,” says Bono. “And the two characters in it are ad­dicted to sort of failure and rebirth.”

“I just asked them, ‘Is it cool if I just butcher this thing?’ ” says Tedder, who al­ternated between joining U2 in the stu­dio and working remotely on the tracks. “And they were like, ‘Do your worst. Go for it.’ ” He added a new chorus melody, turned the old chorus into a bridge, and sent it back to the bandmates. They re­worked it on his model, ending up with a tight, hooky pop song, albe­it one with lines like “Every ship­wrecked soul knows what it is/To live without intimacy.”


Seeing as that version isn't radically different structure-wise from the final product, it's safe to assume that this was one version of the song they came up after Tedder worked on it.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2017, 04:44:24 PM by trevgreg »

Offline Izzy

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #65 on: March 19, 2017, 06:11:00 PM »
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I honestly prefer what some of SOI would have sounded like without Tedder. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login This version of EBW preTedder is a prime example.

A slightly diffent chorus and a little more guitar. Not exactly worlds apart from the album version, which (nicely) accentuates the synth.

I like it without the way too compressed crescendo chorus. Sounds more organic. Shame so much of this stuff is second-guessed by the band.

Offline monopoly

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #66 on: March 19, 2017, 06:43:51 PM »
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I honestly prefer what some of SOI would have sounded like without Tedder. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login This version of EBW preTedder is a prime example.

The problem there is that this alternate version appears to have been made AFTER Tedder's recommendations.

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Tedder did some of his most radical sur­gery on “Every Breaking Wave,” which had been a lyrical but meandering No Line out­take. “It’s about how hard it is to give your­self completely to another person,” says Bono. “And the two characters in it are ad­dicted to sort of failure and rebirth.”

“I just asked them, ‘Is it cool if I just butcher this thing?’ ” says Tedder, who al­ternated between joining U2 in the stu­dio and working remotely on the tracks. “And they were like, ‘Do your worst. Go for it.’ ” He added a new chorus melody, turned the old chorus into a bridge, and sent it back to the bandmates. They re­worked it on his model, ending up with a tight, hooky pop song, albe­it one with lines like “Every ship­wrecked soul knows what it is/To live without intimacy.”


Seeing as that version isn't radically different structure-wise from the final product, it's safe to assume that this was one version of the song they came up after Tedder worked on it.

If that's the case my bad. But the line mentioned isn't new. It's been around since eno and lanois.

Offline braxhunt

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #67 on: March 19, 2017, 08:32:06 PM »
///Instead of passive aggressively proclaiming that people are predictable because they do not believe or enjoy the same things you do... try asking questions and creating opportunities for bi-lateral communication.///

Trust me, I have the greatest appreciation to the @U2 admins and creators. I've religiously followed the site since the 90s. That's kind of the point. I'm annoyed. I admit it.

I get that great albums hold up, and you can really tell over the long run. On the other hand it is meaningfully that each album gets huge praise, and there is a festive attitude in the first few weeks. Few will appreciate this theory, but perhaps it's not just U2 who are influenced by the culture.

We hear all the time that Bono's too focused on radio play, and what's cool with the kids. They white-wash every album. I agree, but WE seem to love it at first. But when the culture tells us what's wrong with it, we seem to slouch and agree. I think the typical U2 fan on the forum would still argue for the merits of a given album . . . even NLOTH, but the influence is there.

I'm speaking in broad brushes and I know that. I'm talking about the amalgam of forum members. There are individual members that don't fit the bill and have darn good reasons for changing their minds.

Nevertheless, when people slack off an album that doesn't exist because of a photograph, I can't resist a fair amount of eye-rolling after all these cycles.

Offline mrsamrocks2

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #68 on: March 19, 2017, 10:03:50 PM »
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I honestly prefer what some of SOI would have sounded like without Tedder. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login This version of EBW preTedder is a prime example.
Well I really don't think this is better than the album version. I'd rather have them "overcook" songs than release an inferior version like this one.
This whole argument about overcooking songs makes me laugh. You guys just have to listen to the Achtung baby outtakes or to songs like Always to realize that the instinct of the band is usually right when they rework on a song.

Offline jick

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #69 on: March 20, 2017, 12:53:12 AM »
I don't think there is a precedent for a band whose members are in their mid-50's to have a radio hit.

Just because Tedder and Lillywhite are in the picture doesn't guarantee anything.

Also, what genre/style constitute a radio hit keeps on changing every generation.  U2 have been around for many generations but its really been a long long time since they had a real radio hit (Vertigo or Beautiful Day perhaps?).

So what the band is demanding from Tedder and Lillywhite would be to do something unprecedented.  Will it happen?  Can it happen?  No one really knows.

But just because Tedder is there doesn't mean it is a given.  It also doesn't mean it will be bad (or good).  It just is what it is, so just fasten your seatbelts and enjoy the ride.

The evolution of U2's music continues....

Cheers,

J

Offline The Edges Cat

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #70 on: March 20, 2017, 05:00:07 AM »
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Do people really think David Bowie was craving a chart hit when making Blackstar? Of course not, he threw off his inhibitions and made his best album of 25 years.

That's because he was dying. He literally finished some songs on his deathbed. 

Offline imaginary friend

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #71 on: March 20, 2017, 08:23:20 AM »
Up until yesterday, I hadn't heard a One Republic song since "Apologize." Heard what I guess is their latest yesterday; some song with the words "let's hurt tonight" in the chorus.

The melody wasn't good. Neither was any of the rest.

Offline Spacejunk69

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #72 on: March 20, 2017, 10:27:26 AM »
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I don't think there is a precedent for a band whose members are in their mid-50's to have a radio hit.

Just because Tedder and Lillywhite are in the picture doesn't guarantee anything.

Also, what genre/style constitute a radio hit keeps on changing every generation.  U2 have been around for many generations but its really been a long long time since they had a real radio hit (Vertigo or Beautiful Day perhaps?).

So what the band is demanding from Tedder and Lillywhite would be to do something unprecedented.  Will it happen?  Can it happen?  No one really knows.

But just because Tedder is there doesn't mean it is a given.  It also doesn't mean it will be bad (or good).  It just is what it is, so just fasten your seatbelts and enjoy the ride.

The evolution of U2's music continues....

Cheers,

J

Yeah this is a good post, however I really do not think U2's music has 'evolved' from anything after All That You Cant Leave Behind. That album did evolve from Pop and the 90's phenomenon - not in a good way mind, but it evolved. Since then, nah. Same old, same old (sub standard output).

Offline Spacejunk69

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #73 on: March 20, 2017, 10:27:58 AM »
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Interesting that when Elbow frontman Guy Garvey was asked about the follow up Build A Rocket Boys to their smash hit album Seldom Seen Kid, he was asked about its apparent lack of 'radio-friendliness', stating:

"We could write deliberate radio hits until the cows come home, but I think you can hear it really obviously when a band has done that."

As a result, that Elbow album sounded like a natural development from their arena filling album, and neither sought to replicate it or out do it.

And that really sums up U2 and Ryan Tedder - real music fans can usually tell how hollow and crowd baiting these are songs. Like bubblegum, it's going to taste pleasant but the taste will wear of soon. And that sums up every pop star Tedder has worked with - there's nothing substantial, thought provoking or inherently moving in his tunes. They are not 'artists' - they are great marketers of focus grouped pop that is flimsy beyond belief without any artistic merit. They used to be able to write chart topping anthems, but those days are long gone, and we can all the difference between authenticity and desperation. But that shouldn't deter them. When U2 are themselves, and without the self-conscience that has crippled them and the musical straitjacket that they fit into to desperately appeal to the masses, they are at their best and can still create brilliant music.

Do people really think David Bowie was craving a chart hit when making Blackstar? Of course not, he threw off his inhibitions and made his best album of 25 years. U2 can do this when they want - Moment of Surrender, The Troubles, Sleep Like A Baby Tonight, Cedars of Lebanon, Raised By Wolves (even if the latter is ruined by tinny energy sapping production, the makings of an excellent song is there).

The talent still remains. Of course nobody is expecting a masterpiece like Achtung Baby or The Joshua Tree, but us hardcore fans are still sure that they can go from making merely decent albums to excellent albums. We're not asking for greatness, just something on a level much more subtle and sophisticated with artistic credibility, and certainly less shallow, than their recent offerings. This is U2 after all - us fans expect high standards and if we're not given it, then we have a right to bemoan a once great band resorting to such cheap, tedious, artistically null, bland pop stars like Ryan Tedder.

Another great post.

Offline MattD

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Re: Tedder working with Steve
« Reply #74 on: March 20, 2017, 10:48:28 AM »
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Do people really think David Bowie was craving a chart hit when making Blackstar? Of course not, he threw off his inhibitions and made his best album of 25 years.

That's because he was dying. He literally finished some songs on his deathbed.

That's not true - for most of the album, Tony Visconti recounted that Bowie was confident of beating cancer and making more albums. Many of these songs had been recorded prior to a terminal diagnosis, even the apparently ominous Lazarus was not actually referring to his disease. I doubt Bowie would have done things differently if he did not have cancer. Let's be brutally honest here - if Bowie had resorted to hiring the likes of Ryan Tedder and Paul Epworth, would the album have been as good? Of course not.

Fine, many may say 'don't criticise an album you haven't heard' and fair enough, but the dull opening half of Songs of Innocence with its bland pop lyrics and forced and plastic anthemic melodies, along with the dreadful You're The Best Thing About Me that we've heard, display very very worrying signs for this album.