Poll

How do you feel about this issue? If you are viewing you should vote!

I think nobody should criticize
I think only constructive criticism should be allowed
I have no opinion
I think people should wait until the album comes out to criticize/cheer it
I think people should be able to say what they want

Author Topic: The SOE Fan Police  (Read 1054 times)

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Offline WookieeWarrior10

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #15 on: October 10, 2017, 04:02:30 PM »
You should be able to say whatever you want... within reason. That's not to say that all criticism must be constructive (as I am a fairly vocal proponent for freedom of speech around here), but that it should have some relevance to discussion and not exist for the purpose of antagonization.

Personally, I'm with Exile in thinking that our thoughts should be reserved until the album is eventually released. Despite this, I wouldn't want to prevent anybody from sharing their opinion (albeit premature) beforehand.

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People should be able to say whatever they want.

But why do you want to take away the fun away from others. If you like something, and dozens of people are chopping that 'something' down, the thread is not a nice place.

In that kind of threads you can state you don't like it. But you shouldn't burn it. Use and/or make other threads about that.
When did I say I did???

I don't think that JFW was directing his post towards you, only generally speaking.

Offline JFW

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #16 on: October 10, 2017, 04:06:08 PM »
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People should be able to say whatever they want.

But why do you want to take away the fun away from others. If you like something, and dozens of people are chopping that 'something' down, the thread is not a nice place.

In that kind of threads you can state you don't like it. But you shouldn't burn it. Use and/or make other threads about that.
When did I say I did???

I don't think that JFW was directing his post towards you, only generally speaking.
O, no! Sorry, missed your post WhenIsSOE. Wookie is right, nothing to do with you or anyone specific. ;)

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #17 on: October 10, 2017, 04:12:53 PM »
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People should be able to say whatever they want.

But why do you want to take away the fun away from others. If you like something, and dozens of people are chopping that 'something' down, the thread is not a nice place.

In that kind of threads you can state you don't like it. But you shouldn't burn it. Use and/or make other threads about that.

Agreed. Separate threads for the most divisive topics go a long way toward keeping the peace on a forum and keeping participation up.

Offline ShankAsu

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #18 on: October 10, 2017, 06:16:23 PM »
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I chose "I have no opinion" because...it keeps me out of trouble.  ;D


If you choose not to decide you still have made a choice.   ::)
I WILL CHOOSE FREEWILL!
"Thank you for your support!"   :-[

Sorry Riffy, not meant as a dis, just having a little fun is all.   ;)
Oh, I totally took it as fun...no worries!
Great!
this is too existential for me...

Offline WookieeWarrior10

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #19 on: October 10, 2017, 10:37:12 PM »
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I chose "I have no opinion" because...it keeps me out of trouble.  ;D


If you choose not to decide you still have made a choice.   ::)
I WILL CHOOSE FREEWILL!
"Thank you for your support!"   :-[

Sorry Riffy, not meant as a dis, just having a little fun is all.   ;)
Oh, I totally took it as fun...no worries!
Great!
this is too existential for me...

I feel transcendentalized.

checks box for big word of the day

Offline Blueyedboy

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #20 on: October 10, 2017, 11:54:10 PM »
I'm all for free speech and all that, but it's real difficult to engage with forum members who offer no context or reasoning behind their opinion.
The Mods do a great (and thankless) job in policing this forum and other members are pretty good in seeing flame posts for what they are, even if the mark is sometimes overstepped.

Offline WhenIsSOE

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #21 on: October 11, 2017, 12:22:20 PM »
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People should be able to say whatever they want.

But why do you want to take away the fun away from others. If you like something, and dozens of people are chopping that 'something' down, the thread is not a nice place.

In that kind of threads you can state you don't like it. But you shouldn't burn it. Use and/or make other threads about that.
When did I say I did???

I don't think that JFW was directing his post towards you, only generally speaking.
O, no! Sorry, missed your post WhenIsSOE. Wookie is right, nothing to do with you or anyone specific. ;)
Oh, sorry for the misunderstanding.  :)

Offline Johnny Feathers

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #22 on: October 11, 2017, 01:37:12 PM »
It seems silly this is even a poll, but of course people should say what they want.

That said, if the album as we know it is limited to, what, 3 songs so far?  (Maybe others have an inside track on others I haven't heard--I just know Blackout, Little Things, and You're the Best Thing About Me.)  Anyway, if it's only 3 songs, then I'd say those are the only songs that warrant discussing.  Maybe those three indicate a direction you like/dislike which you hope/fear the rest of the album will follow, but that's speculation.  The album at this point doesn't suck, and isn't great--we know about a quarter of it.  It's worth keeping that in mind.  We got SOI in one fell swoop, which is the exception to the rule.

To that point, so far this album is pretty meh, with Blackout being the best of the bunch.  I'm hoping for some more interesting stuff in the vein of SLABT that we haven't heard yet.

Offline WhenIsSOE

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #23 on: October 11, 2017, 03:33:10 PM »
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How do you feel about the issue that the forum seems to be going up in flames about?
WTF?!? I didn't repost that!

Offline WhenIsSOE

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #24 on: October 11, 2017, 03:34:19 PM »
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It seems silly this is even a poll, but of course people should say what they want.

That said, if the album as we know it is limited to, what, 3 songs so far?  (Maybe others have an inside track on others I haven't heard--I just know Blackout, Little Things, and You're the Best Thing About Me.)  Anyway, if it's only 3 songs, then I'd say those are the only songs that warrant discussing.  Maybe those three indicate a direction you like/dislike which you hope/fear the rest of the album will follow, but that's speculation.  The album at this point doesn't suck, and isn't great--we know about a quarter of it.  It's worth keeping that in mind.  We got SOI in one fell swoop, which is the exception to the rule.

To that point, so far this album is pretty meh, with Blackout being the best of the bunch.  I'm hoping for some more interesting stuff in the vein of SLABT that we haven't heard yet.
Get Out Of Your Own Way was just leaked, you should google it and take a listen. (Spoiler Alert: It's good!!)

Offline 73October

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #25 on: October 15, 2017, 03:43:26 PM »
I'm just waiting until it comes out and I hear all the tracks in the order that they are in.  Call me old fashioned, but that's how I feel.

Offline fardreamer

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #26 on: October 15, 2017, 05:35:27 PM »
I think people say things online that wouldn't pass muster in a face to face. You are responsible for what you put out.

There's no such thing as 'free speech' on the internet as sites have rules. You agree to them when you sign up.

I've been a moderator on a different site before. It's a hard job and often moderators have to deal with a lot of unpleasantness that the general membership know nothing about.

Offline Saint1322

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #27 on: October 17, 2017, 02:14:43 PM »
And note which option is the runaway leader so far. Hmmmm.

Anyone who criticizes an album before they ever even hear is either being unnecessarily negative out of anxiety or trolling. Either way, best to move on and not engage such a person. But as I said on the other thread, that just isn't an option, I reckon.

I also post on a SW fan site, and plenty of people there are already being negative about film that won't be out for another 58 days. You know what happens to people who do that? The first time, people try to reassure them. The second time, they are asked to stop. The third time they get banned.

What doesn't happen? People don't engage them in a back-and-forth all day, and mods don't treat everyone like they are the problem. The problem gets dealt with and you move on. I saw someone get banned this morning. Either do it, or don't. IMO.

Offline The Exile

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #28 on: October 17, 2017, 02:43:59 PM »
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Anyone who criticizes an album before they ever even hear is either being unnecessarily negative out of anxiety or trolling.

The problem is that when someone says something like, "Well judging from what I have heard so far I don't have high hopes for this album," they are pounced upon by others saying "How can you say SOE sucks without having heard it?"; "Why are haters like this even here?", etc.

See what I mean? In this case, the commenter is not saying SOE "sucks," he is making a preliminary judgment based on (1) a full version of Blackout, (2) several full versions of TBT, (3) tons of good quality live versions of TLT, and (4) enough of GOOYOW to know basically what the song will sound like. So if he has heard a third of SOE in various forms and formulates a skeptical opinion about it, he is passively-aggressively told he isn't wanted here.

But if someone hears snippets of songs in their infancy and likes them, then (and only then) is it okay to form opinions based on less than final information.

This happens here pretty much hourly in almost every thread. It has gotten pretty annoying and intolerable, especially when (speaking for myself) I have gone out of my way to show how much I appreciate post-Pop U2.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2017, 02:51:18 PM by The Exile »

Offline Saint1322

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Re: The SOE Fan Police
« Reply #29 on: October 17, 2017, 03:00:48 PM »
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Anyone who criticizes an album before they ever even hear is either being unnecessarily negative out of anxiety or trolling.

The problem is that when someone says something like, "Well judging from what I have heard so far I don't have high hopes for this album," they are pounced upon by others saying "How can you say SOE sucks without having heard it?"; "Why are haters like this even here?", etc.

See what I mean? In this case, the commenter is not saying SOE "sucks," he is making a preliminary judgment based on (1) a full version of Blackout, (2) several full versions of TBT, (3) tons of good quality live versions of TLT, and (4) enough of GOOYOW to know basically what the song will sound like. So if he has heard a third of SOE in various forms and formulates an opinion about it, he is passively-aggressively told he isn't wanted here.

But if someone hears snippets of songs in their infancy and likes them, then (and only then) is it okay to form opinions based on less than final information.

This happens here pretty much hourly in almost every thread. It has gotten pretty annoying and intolerable, especially when (speaking for myself) I have gone out of my way to show how much I appreciate post-Pop U2.

I understand why someone would say it the way you phrased it, but if it bothered me, I'd just skip over it and move on to the next comment or topic. I don't know about you, but I put too much thought into my posts to want them to just be ignored. If a majority of people think it is silly to judge an album based on a few snippets, and those people just ignore the comment, it will work itself out. That's my point. We need to stop arguing with everything we disagree with or calling for the mods to delete the offending post. Just ignore it.

I mean, I see things here that annoy me, but the only time I jump in is if someone is factually incorrect, not if I disagree with their opinion. I'll participate if I think I can help someone understand something better. I'll give you a great example. I've had this exchange numerous times here:

POPMARTLOVER: I don't understand why U2 don't play songs from Pop.
ME: Because Pop was poorly reviewed and didn't sell as well as the albums that came before it or after it.
POPMARTLOVER: But I love it!
ME: And that's great. I am glad you love it. That's your right. I like about half of it, myself. But the world didn't receive it very well.
POPMARTLOVER: I don't understand why they don't celebrate Pop the way they are The Joshua Tree.
ME: Because The Joshua Tree was an international phenomenon, remains their best-selling album, won multiple Grammys, was the hottest tour of the decade and produced their only U.S. #1 hits. Pop undersold other albums (as I said earlier), all the singles other than Discotheque stiffed, the tour sold poorly in some U.S. markets, the band played very poorly early on tour.
POPMARTLOVER: Stop dismissing my opinion! I love Pop and PopMart, you hater!

OK, now that's the point at which I have to walk away. You said you didn't understand something. I explained it to you in a calm, respectful, rational manner. You didn't accept the explanation and went right back to where you started from. At that point, I can either get frustrated, or move on. I think we all need to learn to move on when an impasse is reached.