Author Topic: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?  (Read 3704 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline DK46

  • Refugee
  • *
  • Posts: 261
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #30 on: December 04, 2017, 09:37:10 PM »
I'm alright with it, it's part of how music is written and how collaboration works.  Granted, Tedder is not credited in the liner notes for writing the song, unlike with Lights of Home (granted that's a sample). 

He's a producer, it's part of his job, I mean they come into the studio with melodies, riffs, ideas, etc.  It's all speculation though, the album was just about finished in 2016, not sure when exactly though.  So, it may have been a demo and Tedder was just messing around with it.  On UTU2TM, Scott and Scott had mentioned a song they were writing for someone else, so maybe this was it, but then U2 wanted it back. 

I do recall Tedder re-writing/wrote parts of Every Breaking Wave and they brought him on because of his gift for melody and Summer of Love's riff is pretty damn catchy. 

Who knows ultimately?  The lyrics are certainly Bono's though as I can't quite see OneRepublic writing a song about Aleppo.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2017, 09:40:37 PM by DK46 »

Offline Albono

  • Child of Grace
  • **
  • Posts: 1,521
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #31 on: December 04, 2017, 09:53:14 PM »
the songs turned out good. no complaints.

Offline emuhunter

  • Refugee
  • *
  • Posts: 219
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #32 on: December 06, 2017, 01:43:16 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Responding to the discussion above, I think it's a mix of both things:
– The Edge's struggles with creativity in recent years.
– A tradition of relying heavily on their producers for sounds.

On the latter, they certainly have form:
– The rhythm guitar (i.e. most of the song!) in Running to Stand Still was written and played by Daniel Lanois. Listen from around 44:54 of this: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

– Also, didn't Brian Eno fall out with U2 because he didn't get any songwriting credits for All That You Can't Leave Behind, on which he apparently contributed more than enough to justify one? As I recall, this is why he and Lanois didn't come back for HTDAAB but were included as full songwriting partners on NLOTH (after they'd made up).

That's really fascinating, I'd be very curious to know more about the Eno/Lanois thing... I hadn't heard about it but it makes sense.

Offline achtung child

  • Headache in a Suitcase
  • *
  • Posts: 393
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #33 on: December 06, 2017, 02:12:29 PM »
Take this with a grain of salt, most of Edge's riffs on this album are related to Page's 'Whole Lotta Love' - which is derivative of every Delta Blues artist - which also includes the Haim riff.  'With or Without You' is a blueprint of classical chord progression.  The only difference is those particular songs aren't publically named.

Offline Allhorizonbomb

  • Wanderer
  • *
  • Posts: 95
  • Self proclaimed biggest U2 fan in New York State
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #34 on: December 06, 2017, 04:11:25 PM »
I think the riff sounds better in the U2 from an objective standpoint, but that may be because I like a more raw sound then a distorted one.

Offline EducateMyMind

  • Wanderer
  • *
  • Posts: 53
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #35 on: December 06, 2017, 07:52:29 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
How do you think I feel?

Betrayed. Bewildered.

Ha! This is great. Don’t pierce the toast!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

PookaMacP

  • Guest
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #36 on: December 07, 2017, 03:54:20 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Responding to the discussion above, I think it's a mix of both things:
– The Edge's struggles with creativity in recent years.
– A tradition of relying heavily on their producers for sounds.

On the latter, they certainly have form:
– The rhythm guitar (i.e. most of the song!) in Running to Stand Still was written and played by Daniel Lanois. Listen from around 44:54 of this: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

– Also, didn't Brian Eno fall out with U2 because he didn't get any songwriting credits for All That You Can't Leave Behind, on which he apparently contributed more than enough to justify one? As I recall, this is why he and Lanois didn't come back for HTDAAB but were included as full songwriting partners on NLOTH (after they'd made up).

That's really fascinating, I'd be very curious to know more about the Eno/Lanois thing... I hadn't heard about it but it makes sense.

Here's what Eno told Q Magazine in 2007 (You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login):
Quote
There were rumours you'd fallen out with U2...

We didn't really fall out, but I was quite upset when All That You Can't Leave Behind came out and on the credits it said under each song, "Music by U2", without mentioning that I'd made a contribution. I wasn't asking for more money. But credits, man, it doesn't cost you anything. But anyway that was all a long time ago and I've forgotten about it now.

Will you work together again?

I'm sure we will at some time, yeah.

Offline jackde65

  • Stranger in a Strange Land
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #37 on: April 06, 2018, 08:25:14 AM »
To say that they "co-wrote" it is a little iffy isn't it. U2 used their guitar riff. They deserve a writing credit for sure and all they money they will obtain from it, but I think of co-writing as working together. To me it just seems like Bono or Edge just said "Hey, that's great riff. Can we use it in our song?" I mean the song "My Song 5" which is an awesome song was written and on an album already. They certainly didn't actively write it for a U2 song. I'm sure they are pleased though. I don't know, "co-written" just sounds weird in this case. And I have no problem at all with U2 using it. I'm happy they are still making good music. Sorry I'm so late to this post.

Offline wons

  • Party Girl/Boy
  • **
  • Posts: 680
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #38 on: April 06, 2018, 10:10:03 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
It's hard to try to imagine what exactly happened there, but I think the band got to stitch together a song Bono was writing with a chord progression The Edge was making (a very common chord progression)... but the riff itself sounds like something that Lanois came up with inside Edge's chord progression. If that's true, I must say that bringing a basic chord progression into life through the design of a riff shows much more musicianship than just coming up with a basic chord progression.

However, regardless of what happened to One, I just think that it's not in the band's best strenghts to come up with subtle or sophisticated ideas (although they have good taste in production). That's why U2 need their producers so much. I'd say Bono can come up with soaring melodies and some weird sh** that sounds convincing while The Edge is good at creating ambience and some minimalistic and confused motifs, and then the band knows how to jam together in a really unique way. But those are all very very raw concepts. Some of this rawness go to the records and are even classic U2 (Streets or the whole TUF album, for example), but this kind of stuff that they know how to come up with was all already done before, so it's over.

My point is that the "decline in songwriting" and the supposition that "Edge and Bono can't come up with their own ideas that are better" are not phrases that I'd use after the revelation that OneRepublic came up with the guitar licks from Summer of Love... because maybe that was always the case with U2 for the most part in their career whenever they were doing something more intricate. Or not.

Also, I'd like to say that I do think they still bring a lot of ideas to the table. Throughout their discography, including SOE, somehow U2 got to sound like U2 everytime, regardless of what they were trying out each time. Their DNA is in their music, and not only because they play the songs, but because they come up with a lot of what's inside them.

Good stuff, appreciate your thoughts. My sense -- and is based only on obsessive reading and listening over the years -- is that the role and importance of the producers have evolved over the years. Up through War, it seems like Lillywhite was mostly responsible for shaping their raw energy and ideas into something cohesive. I've never gotten the sense that he contributed ideas in the way that Eno/Lanois have. Beginning with TUF, Eno/Lanois gave them some new tools/colors to work with, but again, my sense is that they were more responsible for shaping/directing than adding/collaborating. For example, in the "making of the JT" documentary, Edge plays the original 4-track version of Streets, and it's pretty much fully formed musically. I seem to remember hearing other demos from that era in a similar way, where Edge was largely responsible for the music. It feels like that shifted with AB, where they maybe started relying on Eno/Lanois as collaborators more, to the point where they were officially credited as co-writers on NLOTH.

And to be clear, I don't feel like they've run out of ideas just because they're borrowing fromTedder and Haim. For me, it's a combination of two things:  the increasing reliance on multiple producers and the fact that they've added just two or three songs to the canon in nearly 18 years. On that latter point, I'd argue for Beautiful Day, Walk On, and Vertigo. And even if you add a few others, that's still not a lot of top-shelf songwriting compared to what they accomplished in their first 11 years (Boy thru AB).

I'd love to know more of the inside story of the making of their records, but those secrets will probably never come out. ;-)

Added just two or three songs to the cannon in 18 years? They have written, recorded, and released at least 80 songs during that time.

Offline wons

  • Party Girl/Boy
  • **
  • Posts: 680
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #39 on: April 06, 2018, 10:15:04 AM »
This has not really happened that often. I like to think of them as always writing and creating every thing on their own and then working with a producer to record it. But I think over most artist career, it would be unusual if you never wrote any songs with anyone else. Does no mean the creative river has dried up, just means in the process of putting at the best 10 songs or so, those ideas made it on there and they wanted to keep them despite the fact that they came from outside the band.

Offline This Dave

  • Numb
  • **
  • Posts: 772
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #40 on: April 06, 2018, 01:51:39 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
It's fine. They used outside material in Seconds, Playboy Mansion, Cedars Of Lebanon, Wake Up Dead Man, The Ground Beneath Her Feet, 40, Daddy's Gonna Pay For Your Crashed Car, Beautiful Day, Stuck In A Moment, etc, etc. They've never been an insular band when it came to creation.

So this is where we lower the bar again.

Next album will be written by a producer. Larry and Adam won’t even actually play on it (I would bet a few dollars that this is already the case for some of SOE). When this is revealed, someone will talk about how there are other albums where session musicians played instead of the artists, and we’ll lower the bar again.

U2 is ceasing to be a great band, and I’m not going to pretend I don’t see it.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2018, 02:11:55 PM by This Dave »

Offline This Dave

  • Numb
  • **
  • Posts: 772
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #41 on: April 06, 2018, 02:02:10 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Because it was intended as a song for another band when it comes to the One Rep bit.

Regarding Haim, because it was a bit on an already published song.

What if you found out the main sound on New Years Day is actually from another band? You don't think you'd be a little bit sad?

At this point, I think 2/3 of this forum would make an excuse for it. If the band got caught pulling a Mili Vanilli, there’d be an excuse for that. If it turned out they were only ever going to tour JT songs again, there’d be an excuse for that. If it turned out that they were using body doubles dressed as U2 circa 1987 miming to a JT CD, 1/4 of this forum would explain how that’s nothing unusual.

So there are at least two songs on the album which are partially copied from other bands, one song that is the third iteration of the same part (Glastonbury/Volcano/AS), one song which has an identical chorus to a song on the previous album....

Here’s a thought: Pretend it’s a few years ago, and someone told you that’s what the next U2 album would be. Are you applauding that, or are you saying “I sure hope not”?

Do you even remember what U2 was supposed to be, back when you fell in love with this band?
« Last Edit: April 06, 2018, 02:09:29 PM by This Dave »

Offline wons

  • Party Girl/Boy
  • **
  • Posts: 680
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #42 on: April 06, 2018, 03:11:50 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Because it was intended as a song for another band when it comes to the One Rep bit.

Regarding Haim, because it was a bit on an already published song.

What if you found out the main sound on New Years Day is actually from another band? You don't think you'd be a little bit sad?

At this point, I think 2/3 of this forum would make an excuse for it. If the band got caught pulling a Mili Vanilli, there’d be an excuse for that. If it turned out they were only ever going to tour JT songs again, there’d be an excuse for that. If it turned out that they were using body doubles dressed as U2 circa 1987 miming to a JT CD, 1/4 of this forum would explain how that’s nothing unusual.

So there are at least two songs on the album which are partially copied from other bands, one song that is the third iteration of the same part (Glastonbury/Volcano/AS), one song which has an identical chorus to a song on the previous album....

Here’s a thought: Pretend it’s a few years ago, and someone told you that’s what the next U2 album would be. Are you applauding that, or are you saying “I sure hope not”?

Do you even remember what U2 was supposed to be, back when you fell in love with this band?

Its just parts of two songs, not the whole album of 13 songs. Parts of the album POP were lifted from other artist work. But the vast majority was not.

Offline 73October

  • Staring at the Sun
  • **
  • Posts: 1,260
  • Joy is an act of defiance
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #43 on: April 08, 2018, 09:30:59 AM »
Funnily, I always thought that Blessed Be Your Name by Matt Redman (Christian worship leader) was ripped from With or Without You.  Which makes it a better song in my opinion.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login


Offline davis

  • Stateless
  • *
  • Posts: 103
Re: How do people feel that U2 has used bits from Haim/ One Republic songs?
« Reply #44 on: April 08, 2018, 01:15:57 PM »
I think most of us have long overlooked the contributions of producers to U2 songs since UF.  Is it really debatable that JT and AB owe as much to Eno and Lanois as to the Bono and Edge?  Or, rather, that they are the result of a unique collaborative process? 

When I first realized this I felt crummy about life for a while.  I wanted to believe those four guys were untouchable geniuses (though why did I want to believe this?), solely responsible for their greatest songs and albums.  Then I realized it's the work that matters. 

We know the peak of what U2 could achieve artistically on their own: War.  Then they made the wise choice to invite other creative personalities into their work.  This choice led to a career decades longer than it would have been, with much higher highs.

And, for what it's worth, the greatness of U2 music would never have existed without Larry, Adam, Bono, and the Edge, even if those four men are not solely responsible for it.