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The Music and Lyrics / Re: North Star and Mercy
« Last post by Bundang Dave on Today at 06:01:30 AM »
I think both songs are OK, but for me the best 2-song combos live would be Miami-Bullet the Blue Sky, or Zoo Station-The Fly.
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General U2 Discussion / Re: The Joshua Tree is over-rated
« Last post by Blueyedboy on Today at 01:53:20 AM »
It's not overrated,  just overplayed.

Although is not my favorite U2 album its one of their most complete. The fact that songs such as Heartland didn't make the cut show the abundance of riches they had at their disposal.  The B Sides weren't to shabby either. Even the '87 version of The Sweetest Thing is bearable.

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The Music and Lyrics / Re: Rattle and Hum: Retrospective
« Last post by Chip on Today at 01:24:34 AM »
I saw R&H the movie first, sometime almost certainly in the summer of '89 (or even late spring) after it came out on video, which back then of course meant VHS. I was still not a fan at that point (that would come later in the fall) but thought it was artistically near-masterful as a concert film; I thought Jouneau did a great job as director. I would rent the movie again after I became a fan, but it would be another three-and-a-quarter years before I would finally get the album. Of the new songs, I remember noting "Heartland" as standing out during that first viewing, and the scene of the band sitting on the hill above the Mississippi is still my favorite one in the film.
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The Music and Lyrics / Re: Landlady - would it work live?
« Last post by Chip on Today at 01:14:31 AM »
"Landlady's" my second favorite song on SOE. The band did rehearse it, so anything's possible. Thematically, however, I don't see it fitting anywhere in e&i other than as a replacement for, or right after, YTBTAM. It's not a mortality or innocence song, so it doesn't fit in the first half, and it doesn't fit in the encore either. Even though I expect some set list changes for future tour legs, the show's basic thematic structure will stay the same, I'm wagering. That's how it's been with past tours, at any rate.
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General U2 Discussion / Re: Songs Of Experience sales in the United States
« Last post by wons on July 18, 2018, 09:44:09 PM »
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Thanks, wons.  These are sobering stats.  I have been fascinated by this thread because it offers a glimpse of how many of "us" there are out there.  A dwindling amount, it appears.

My pleasure! So 319,000 people purchased the album in either a physical or digital format. A much smaller group of people either streamed or puchased individual tracks from the album equivalent to maybe another 30,000 albums sold. Billboard considers the sale of 10 individual track downloads to = One album sold. Billboard considers 1,500 streams = to One Album sold.

The POP album was considered a poor seller back in 1997 by U2's standards and industry standards at the time. But at least everyone who purchased a ticket for POPMART purchased one copy of the POP album. I'm not exactly sure about this, but it seems like only 1/2 or 1/3 of the people who went to see the Experience Tour purchased the album or listened to it. That seems odd considering that most of the fanbase knows a tour like this is not a nostalgia event but is about the new album primarily.

Wons,

Iíve asked this before but you never answered.  By default, didnít EVERYONE who bought a ticket for E&I buy the CD as well?  Or are you saying the 319,000 includes those sales and there were 400K to 600K who bought tickets.   Meaning only 1/3 to 1/2 redeemed their included CD,  less the people who didnít buy tickets but bought the CD.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No.

Only a fraction of the people who purchased TICKETS for the tour got the album in a digital or physical format FROM their TICKET PURCHASE. That number, is then added to sales of the album that occurred, 1. through online stores for digital formats and physical formats and 2.  people who went to a physical store to pick up a physical copy of the album.

So album sales came from three sources:
1. Album/ticket bundle
2. online sales of digital and physical formats
3. Physical stores selling a physical copy of the album

All 3 of those combine for a total of 319,000 in sales.

The number of tickets sold for the tour in the United States was 438,059. I don't know the exact figure, but it could be as little as 50,000 of ticket buyers redeeming the album and getting in digital or physical format with the purchase of the ticket.

One important thing is, you could NOT use the ticket purchase to get DELUXE album version of the album. The only way to get the DELUXE version of the album was to purchase it from an online store or a physical store.

Personally, I'm responsible for 3 of the albums in the 319,000 album total since I purchased the DELUXE version of the album at the local record store and then redeemed each of the two tickets I purchased for a copy of the album. The copy of the album offered is just the regular album with only 13 tracks. I kept one and gave the other one away.


Its not clear what the exact breakdown of the 319,000 is in terms of what and how people got their albums. I might be able to dig up some of that data for the first week of sales which were 180,000, more than half the total. The breaking down between physical vs digital formats is probably 50/50.


I hope that makes it clear.

So, to me, that just indicates that my preferences are not uncommon.  There are a lot of people out there that have no use for a physical disc.  I canít remember if my ticket offered a digital download or CD, but I think it was just CD.



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Every person who purchased a ticket had the option to get the album in digital format or physical format. All sales are physical and digital combined. My argument here has NEVER been about CD's(which you mysteriously continue to talk about) or specifically any physical product. A digital album sold is the same as a physical cd or record sold. What is not the same is streaming.

Your preference though is to stream the music which is NOT the same as purchasing the album in a digital format. Purchasing the album, regardless of format is all the same. Streaming is an entirely different thing.

90% of the people, which does not include YOU, purchased this album in either a digital or physical format. Your group, the streamers, comprise less than 10% of the people who have listened to the album.

So when it comes to U2 fans who have listened to Songs Of Experience, your preference for streaming as opposed to purchasing the album, is very uncommon.

I do realize digital copy and CD is the same as far as sales.  Thatís why I asked if a digital copy or CD was offered with the ticket.

So you have your answer then donít you?  A large percentage of the fans who went to the show are uninterested in the new album.  I donít really find that surprising.  Most people that go to shows like U2 are going for legacy reasons.  The latest album has not received alot of mainstream attention.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

For most of U2's career, the new album and whether it was successful or not played the primary factor in whether the tour was a success. U2 had their first downturn with the POPMART tour and it was because the POP album was poorly received. The next three albums and did very well though and so did their tours. This is the first tour U2 has ever done where the number of fans who purchased or listened to the album was less than the number of fans that purchased a ticket for the tour. For POP and POPMART it was one for one. But typically, album sales have always been greater than ticket sales.

So unfortunately it appears that the legacy factor is for the first time dominating things over the new album which is not good news for the band. It shows that overall interest in the band is dwindling. While some "legacy acts" do record business, most get stuck playing the local farm show or town festival. Its not the ideal place to be. The ideal is having new music that brings in new fans, old fans, and everything in between + the legacy factor. That is when the business incredible or record breaking like on the Vertigo Tour and the 360 tour.

Still, selling 319,000 copies of an album in 2017/2018 is not bad at all. Justin Timberlake's latest has only done a little over 400,000. The sad fact is most people are not even listening to albums in any format anymore. Their just listening to individual songs, a couple from this artist, a couple from that artist. Technology has killed the album regardless of the format it is in. That's not good for artist in the future, because individual songs are not a very good basis for building fandom and getting fans to spend $100 dollars a ticket or more to come to a show. As the public becomes less invested in any particular artist, they become less likely to support concert performances. Why go see a band or artist when you only like or listen to two of their songs? The public is starting to place LESS VALUE on music in general, and even less value on the artist that produce the music.

But U2 are an album band! They always have been. That means they produce albums that from first track to last, are fantastic with no filler. It takes incredible talent to be able to do that. People use to appreciate that, but not anymore it seems.

Still, I hope U2 do not lose heart and realize that they still have a very dedicated following that is interested in their new music and generally prefer the album/tour cycle that is based around new music which is what the band has always been about.



To be honest, though, Iím not really following what all of this data and analysis is supposed to telling me, or how Iím supposed to react.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

This is one of the elements of the business side of U2 which naturally does have some impact on their career and the choices they make in the future. Its also interesting to look at and compare with how other artist are doing just for that reason alone. By clicking on and reading this thread, you've at least showed some interest in the subject.
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The Music and Lyrics / Re: Landlady - would it work live?
« Last post by bw on July 18, 2018, 09:03:34 PM »
Best song on the album. A great piece of music. Why they donít play it is beyond me. Very disappointing. I was fired up for that live.

I had the same reaction to Yahweh. The best song on HTDAAB. They played it a few times but, sadly, reduced it to an acoustic version; and Bono removed some lyrics. That song really moved me and had a great cinematic finish...
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The Music and Lyrics / Re: North Star and Mercy
« Last post by bw on July 18, 2018, 08:55:50 PM »
They butchered Mercy when Bono changed the lyrics. And that broke my heart.

The version that would have been on HTDAAB is one of the greatest U2 songs ever. How that missed the cut on HTDAATB is one of the most bewildering things ever in the U2 history...
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The Music and Lyrics / Re: Rattle and Hum: Retrospective
« Last post by SwimmingSorrows on July 18, 2018, 07:50:02 PM »
I kind of got into U2 through the movie.  I knew and liked a few U2 songs, but I wasn't really a fan of them yet.  What pushed me over the edge was a video by a music YouTuber I really like called Todd in the Shadows.  The video is called "The Top 5 Awful Moments in U2's Rattle and Hum."  Here's a link to it:

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The guy who made it is a U2 fan despite the title, and he praises the live version of Sunday Bloody Sunday in Rattle and Hum.  After seeing this video, I went and watched that performance several times.  Soon after, I listened to The Joshua Tree, and then then everything else fell into place.

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General Music Discussion / Re: Springsteen on Broadway
« Last post by laoghaire on July 18, 2018, 06:26:01 PM »
Wow that sounds amazing.
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General U2 Discussion / Re: The Joshua Tree is over-rated
« Last post by Clarky on July 18, 2018, 05:36:50 PM »
Well said last two posts.
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