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@U2 HQ => Feedback, Suggestions and Help Desk => Topic started by: briscoetheque on December 30, 2016, 01:31:06 AM

Title: Bannings
Post by: briscoetheque on December 30, 2016, 01:31:06 AM
Just a suggestion...

With the season of banning upon us is there any way to see if a user is currently banned?

Not debating the relative merits of the new approach or however you in mod land choose to apply the rules as that is not up for justification, transparency or debate as we are reminded often.

Would be nice though to see if someone you're communicating with is banned.

Other sites will say 'currently banned' under a user name for example.

Merit?
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: riffraff on December 30, 2016, 04:59:30 AM
I think this is a fine idea. Then we would know where our banboy friends are, and not worry about them so much. It would also be nice to be able to see "permanently banned" so that we can heave a sigh of relief, in some cases.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: il_capo on December 30, 2016, 06:47:27 AM
I concur, it'd be helpful to know someone is banned rather than just not posting, as we might worry the user is unwell or troubled in some way if they suddenly become silent. 
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: an tha on December 30, 2016, 07:04:46 AM
it is a community and as such people within that community should be able to know the whereabouts/be able to reach people they 'care' about within that community....or at least know their status should they want to...
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: il_capo on December 30, 2016, 07:09:31 AM
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it is a community and as such people within that community should be able to know the whereabouts/be able to reach people they 'care' about within that community....or at least know their status should they want to...

Can you send/receive PMs when banned? 
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: briscoetheque on December 30, 2016, 07:47:13 AM
Nup, coz you can't log in. Which is fair enough too.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: an tha on December 30, 2016, 08:29:35 AM
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it is a community and as such people within that community should be able to know the whereabouts/be able to reach people they 'care' about within that community....or at least know their status should they want to...

Can you send/receive PMs when banned?

No ....you can't even view forum...you just get a message saying you are banned and can't access....mine told me when it expired when i first tried logging in to discover was banned....but i didn't really clock it when i tried again it just said you are banned guest and the ban is not set to expire..

you get an email with a link to a pm from mods but you can't view the pm because you can't view forum...the text of the pm is in email body though although it says you can't reply to email and offers link ironicallly to reply on email to reply but you can't....
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: il_capo on December 30, 2016, 08:51:24 AM
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it is a community and as such people within that community should be able to know the whereabouts/be able to reach people they 'care' about within that community....or at least know their status should they want to...

Can you send/receive PMs when banned?

No ....you can't even view forum...you just get a message saying you are banned and can't access....mine told me when it expired when i first tried logging in to discover was banned....but i didn't really clock it when i tried again it just said you are banned guest and the ban is not set to expire..

you get an email with a link to a pm from mods but you can't view the pm because you can't view forum...the text of the pm is in email body though although it says you can't reply to email and offers link ironicallly to reply on email to reply but you can't....

Well, as I say it's not a democracy but given you are one of the most active forum members (over 7,000 posts) it would be good if there was a way the rest of us could know what had happened and how long you were going to be away for.  Surely we want to keep our active posters if possible, so we're glad you back in time for 2017.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: an tha on December 30, 2016, 09:18:30 AM
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it is a community and as such people within that community should be able to know the whereabouts/be able to reach people they 'care' about within that community....or at least know their status should they want to...

Can you send/receive PMs when banned?

No ....you can't even view forum...you just get a message saying you are banned and can't access....mine told me when it expired when i first tried logging in to discover was banned....but i didn't really clock it when i tried again it just said you are banned guest and the ban is not set to expire..

you get an email with a link to a pm from mods but you can't view the pm because you can't view forum...the text of the pm is in email body though although it says you can't reply to email and offers link ironicallly to reply on email to reply but you can't....

Well, as I say it's not a democracy but given you are one of the most active forum members (over 7,000 posts) it would be good if there was a way the rest of us could know what had happened and how long you were going to be away for.  Surely we want to keep our active posters if possible, so we're glad you back in time for 2017.

i would imagine that there are plenty of people who wish i wasn't around and i dare say they'll get their wish soon enough!  ;)

anyway.....off with the horns and on with the show.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: il_capo on December 30, 2016, 09:26:57 AM
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it is a community and as such people within that community should be able to know the whereabouts/be able to reach people they 'care' about within that community....or at least know their status should they want to...

Can you send/receive PMs when banned?

No ....you can't even view forum...you just get a message saying you are banned and can't access....mine told me when it expired when i first tried logging in to discover was banned....but i didn't really clock it when i tried again it just said you are banned guest and the ban is not set to expire..

you get an email with a link to a pm from mods but you can't view the pm because you can't view forum...the text of the pm is in email body though although it says you can't reply to email and offers link ironicallly to reply on email to reply but you can't....

Well, as I say it's not a democracy but given you are one of the most active forum members (over 7,000 posts) it would be good if there was a way the rest of us could know what had happened and how long you were going to be away for.  Surely we want to keep our active posters if possible, so we're glad you back in time for 2017.

i would imagine that there are plenty of people who wish i wasn't around and i dare say they'll get their wish soon enough!  ;)

anyway.....off with the horns and on with the show.

You can rub people up the wrong way from time to time - benign though I am, even I had to restrain myself from writing of your output,  "over 7,000 whines"  :P  But life would be boring if everyone agreed and the test of a healthy forum is whether it can incorporate a diverse spread of views.  Nevertheless, it would be nice if you could spice your posts with a few more positive comments from time to time  :)
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: ShankAsu on December 30, 2016, 09:49:39 AM
I'd be curious to know who was banned.  I'm sure I've angered plenty of people on here, and people have rubbed me the wrong way from time to time, but typically I get along well with most people on the majority of the threads.  I did block two people this last year, but to be honest, I'd rather have the option to do that than to see someone get outright banned.  But if people are acting vicious and making personal attacks, there is no room for that.  Either way, the mods seem to be on the offensive trying to clean up the behavior and I understand and appreciate that.  I wish they would allow more of the Real World topics to stick around that don't generate arguments.  Who would ever think that a U2 discussion board could be so intense?  Or actually maybe it makes perfect sense.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: an tha on December 30, 2016, 10:09:01 AM
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it is a community and as such people within that community should be able to know the whereabouts/be able to reach people they 'care' about within that community....or at least know their status should they want to...

Can you send/receive PMs when banned?

No ....you can't even view forum...you just get a message saying you are banned and can't access....mine told me when it expired when i first tried logging in to discover was banned....but i didn't really clock it when i tried again it just said you are banned guest and the ban is not set to expire..

you get an email with a link to a pm from mods but you can't view the pm because you can't view forum...the text of the pm is in email body though although it says you can't reply to email and offers link ironicallly to reply on email to reply but you can't....

Well, as I say it's not a democracy but given you are one of the most active forum members (over 7,000 posts) it would be good if there was a way the rest of us could know what had happened and how long you were going to be away for.  Surely we want to keep our active posters if possible, so we're glad you back in time for 2017.

i would imagine that there are plenty of people who wish i wasn't around and i dare say they'll get their wish soon enough!  ;)

anyway.....off with the horns and on with the show.

You can rub people up the wrong way from time to time - benign though I am, even I had to restrain myself from writing of your output,  "over 7,000 whines"  :P  But life would be boring if everyone agreed and the test of a healthy forum is whether it can incorporate a diverse spread of views.  Nevertheless, it would be nice if you could spice your posts with a few more positive comments from time to time  :)

For you, honey....anything...see exhibit A...

http://forum.atu2.com/index.php/topic,30125.0.html

Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: il_capo on December 30, 2016, 10:19:01 AM
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it is a community and as such people within that community should be able to know the whereabouts/be able to reach people they 'care' about within that community....or at least know their status should they want to...

Can you send/receive PMs when banned?

No ....you can't even view forum...you just get a message saying you are banned and can't access....mine told me when it expired when i first tried logging in to discover was banned....but i didn't really clock it when i tried again it just said you are banned guest and the ban is not set to expire..

you get an email with a link to a pm from mods but you can't view the pm because you can't view forum...the text of the pm is in email body though although it says you can't reply to email and offers link ironicallly to reply on email to reply but you can't....

Well, as I say it's not a democracy but given you are one of the most active forum members (over 7,000 posts) it would be good if there was a way the rest of us could know what had happened and how long you were going to be away for.  Surely we want to keep our active posters if possible, so we're glad you back in time for 2017.

i would imagine that there are plenty of people who wish i wasn't around and i dare say they'll get their wish soon enough!  ;)

anyway.....off with the horns and on with the show.

You can rub people up the wrong way from time to time - benign though I am, even I had to restrain myself from writing of your output,  "over 7,000 whines"  :P  But life would be boring if everyone agreed and the test of a healthy forum is whether it can incorporate a diverse spread of views.  Nevertheless, it would be nice if you could spice your posts with a few more positive comments from time to time  :)

For you, honey....anything...see exhibit A...

http://forum.atu2.com/index.php/topic,30125.0.html

Following on from that, I've been thinking we should have a topic on the greatness of North and South of the River.  I think that song is one of Bono's best lyrics and I think they do it better than Christy Moore.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: an tha on December 30, 2016, 10:40:50 AM
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it is a community and as such people within that community should be able to know the whereabouts/be able to reach people they 'care' about within that community....or at least know their status should they want to...

Can you send/receive PMs when banned?

No ....you can't even view forum...you just get a message saying you are banned and can't access....mine told me when it expired when i first tried logging in to discover was banned....but i didn't really clock it when i tried again it just said you are banned guest and the ban is not set to expire..

you get an email with a link to a pm from mods but you can't view the pm because you can't view forum...the text of the pm is in email body though although it says you can't reply to email and offers link ironicallly to reply on email to reply but you can't....

Well, as I say it's not a democracy but given you are one of the most active forum members (over 7,000 posts) it would be good if there was a way the rest of us could know what had happened and how long you were going to be away for.  Surely we want to keep our active posters if possible, so we're glad you back in time for 2017.

i would imagine that there are plenty of people who wish i wasn't around and i dare say they'll get their wish soon enough!  ;)

anyway.....off with the horns and on with the show.

You can rub people up the wrong way from time to time - benign though I am, even I had to restrain myself from writing of your output,  "over 7,000 whines"  :P  But life would be boring if everyone agreed and the test of a healthy forum is whether it can incorporate a diverse spread of views.  Nevertheless, it would be nice if you could spice your posts with a few more positive comments from time to time  :)

For you, honey....anything...see exhibit A...

http://forum.atu2.com/index.php/topic,30125.0.html

Following on from that, I've been thinking we should have a topic on the greatness of North and South of the River.  I think that song is one of Bono's best lyrics and I think they do it better than Christy Moore.

B side to Staring at the Sun?....I used to by all the singles back then in all the formats.

In all honesty I am not a big fan of it...it is ok.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: il_capo on December 30, 2016, 10:55:48 AM
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it is a community and as such people within that community should be able to know the whereabouts/be able to reach people they 'care' about within that community....or at least know their status should they want to...

Can you send/receive PMs when banned?

No ....you can't even view forum...you just get a message saying you are banned and can't access....mine told me when it expired when i first tried logging in to discover was banned....but i didn't really clock it when i tried again it just said you are banned guest and the ban is not set to expire..

you get an email with a link to a pm from mods but you can't view the pm because you can't view forum...the text of the pm is in email body though although it says you can't reply to email and offers link ironicallly to reply on email to reply but you can't....

Well, as I say it's not a democracy but given you are one of the most active forum members (over 7,000 posts) it would be good if there was a way the rest of us could know what had happened and how long you were going to be away for.  Surely we want to keep our active posters if possible, so we're glad you back in time for 2017.

i would imagine that there are plenty of people who wish i wasn't around and i dare say they'll get their wish soon enough!  ;)

anyway.....off with the horns and on with the show.

You can rub people up the wrong way from time to time - benign though I am, even I had to restrain myself from writing of your output,  "over 7,000 whines"  :P  But life would be boring if everyone agreed and the test of a healthy forum is whether it can incorporate a diverse spread of views.  Nevertheless, it would be nice if you could spice your posts with a few more positive comments from time to time  :)

For you, honey....anything...see exhibit A...

http://forum.atu2.com/index.php/topic,30125.0.html

Following on from that, I've been thinking we should have a topic on the greatness of North and South of the River.  I think that song is one of Bono's best lyrics and I think they do it better than Christy Moore.

B side to Staring at the Sun?....I used to by all the singles back then in all the formats.

In all honesty I am not a big fan of it...it is ok.

It was over-produced and I don't much like the vocal on the released version, but still prefer it to CM's version.

This version they did on TV in Ireland I like better: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yQ5V5Fb18k 
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: imaginary friend on December 30, 2016, 11:32:25 AM
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it is a community and as such people within that community should be able to know the whereabouts/be able to reach people they 'care' about within that community....or at least know their status should they want to...

Can you send/receive PMs when banned?

No ....you can't even view forum...you just get a message saying you are banned and can't access....mine told me when it expired when i first tried logging in to discover was banned....but i didn't really clock it when i tried again it just said you are banned guest and the ban is not set to expire..

you get an email with a link to a pm from mods but you can't view the pm because you can't view forum...the text of the pm is in email body though although it says you can't reply to email and offers link ironicallly to reply on email to reply but you can't....

I think banned people can plead their case to admin/mods by e-mailing forum@atu2.com
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: an tha on December 30, 2016, 11:47:11 AM
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it is a community and as such people within that community should be able to know the whereabouts/be able to reach people they 'care' about within that community....or at least know their status should they want to...

Can you send/receive PMs when banned?

No ....you can't even view forum...you just get a message saying you are banned and can't access....mine told me when it expired when i first tried logging in to discover was banned....but i didn't really clock it when i tried again it just said you are banned guest and the ban is not set to expire..

you get an email with a link to a pm from mods but you can't view the pm because you can't view forum...the text of the pm is in email body though although it says you can't reply to email and offers link ironicallly to reply on email to reply but you can't....

I think banned people can plead their case to admin/mods by e-mailing forum@atu2.com

I sent an email to that address 7 days ago and received no response .....i appreciate it has been xmas but still...some acknowledgement would have been nice.

I think one of the challenges this forum faces is that there is talk of a community but it is so vast spread over continents and timezones etc. that it struggles to build a real personal touch in how that community interacts with the admin/mods and vice versa...

For my money none of the mods really spend enough time actually participating in any discussions to understand some of the relationships, senses of humour or whether what they see as an offence is really an offence or just banter from people who have certain relationships etc on the forum...

I also think the global spread and different types of sense of humour make a tricky mix at times that possibly the mods aren't as clued up on as maybe would be ideal...as tricky a job as it is of course!

I am aware that the policy here is very much one of 'do as you are told' but i believe that a more collaborative approach with the membership would help breed a healthier environment, community and atmopshere.

I'd like to think my comments are received as they are intended and that is positively and with a desire to see a better community here.

Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: il_capo on December 30, 2016, 01:07:25 PM
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it is a community and as such people within that community should be able to know the whereabouts/be able to reach people they 'care' about within that community....or at least know their status should they want to...

Can you send/receive PMs when banned?

No ....you can't even view forum...you just get a message saying you are banned and can't access....mine told me when it expired when i first tried logging in to discover was banned....but i didn't really clock it when i tried again it just said you are banned guest and the ban is not set to expire..

you get an email with a link to a pm from mods but you can't view the pm because you can't view forum...the text of the pm is in email body though although it says you can't reply to email and offers link ironicallly to reply on email to reply but you can't....

I think banned people can plead their case to admin/mods by e-mailing forum@atu2.com

I sent an email to that address 7 days ago and received no response .....i appreciate it has been xmas but still...some acknowledgement would have been nice.

I think one of the challenges this forum faces is that there is talk of a community but it is so vast spread over continents and timezones etc. that it struggles to build a real personal touch in how that community interacts with the admin/mods and vice versa...

For my money none of the mods really spend enough time actually participating in any discussions to understand some of the relationships, senses of humour or whether what they see as an offence is really an offence or just banter from people who have certain relationships etc on the forum...

I also think the global spread and different types of sense of humour make a tricky mix at times that possibly the mods aren't as clued up on as maybe would be ideal...as tricky a job as it is of course!

I am aware that the policy here is very much one of 'do as you are told' but i believe that a more collaborative approach with the membership would help breed a healthier environment, community and atmopshere.

I'd like to think my comments are received as they are intended and that is positively and with a desire to see a better community here.

To be fair to the mods, when they censor a message they generally give an explanation why.  I recall posting a link to the Henri Vidal statue Cain in response to your saying you voted Brexit.  The mod quickly picked up that it represented a facepalm and so deleted the post, explaining I might have hurt your feelings with such a post, and moreover it added nothing to the debate.  He was right it added nothing to the debate, except humour, which as you say is easily lost in translation on an international forum.

As for them engaging more in the debates on the forum it might actually help that they are more detached as it's easier to have emotional distance when you're not involved, and thus you are more likely to achieve a level of impartiality.  That said we probably need a few more mods if your email about being banned was not addressed for such a long period.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: ShankAsu on December 30, 2016, 01:15:20 PM
An Tha, i take it that you were able to negotiate your un-banned status then since you're here today?  Or how did that work?
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: il_capo on December 30, 2016, 01:24:14 PM
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An Tha, i take it that you were able to negotiate your un-banned status then since you're here today?  Or how did that work?

The ban was a time-limited 1 week thing.  His week in the cooler is now expired... alas for us guys ;)
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: briscoetheque on December 30, 2016, 02:34:28 PM
Guys this thread isn't for discussing any specific banning. The rules are very clear on that within the forum guidelines. My question is a general one.

Which isn't to say there aren't some well-made points presented in a level headed and calm way...

But mine is a general site-wide technical suggestion about noting bannings.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: il_capo on December 30, 2016, 02:45:31 PM
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Guys this thread isn't for discussing any specific banning. The rules are very clear on that within the forum guidelines. My question is a general one.

Which isn't to say there aren't some well-made points presented in a level headed and calm way...

But mine is a general site-wide technical suggestion about noting bannings.

Thanks for that briscotheque; I support the technical point about a notification for bans.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: singnomore on December 30, 2016, 02:48:46 PM
Briscoe - a good example of self regulation and I'm not going to comment on individual bans

Forum members get banned for a variety of reasons including because they been reported by fellow forum members. Personally I don't see the merit in publicising when a ban has been enforced. The focus should be on working within the rules of the forum so we dont need bans or sanctions. Support the community by self regulation but also simply dont put yourselves in that position in the first place where a ban or sanction needs to be considered.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: briscoetheque on December 30, 2016, 02:56:33 PM
Sing - thanks. Perhaps not a list of who's banned and for how long, you have that in the mods lounge which is where it belongs.

But I think there is clearly merit in a user's status under their Av or similar to alert those engaged in conversation, quoting, or expecting some sort of response that the user is banned.

No detail, no dates, just something like:

Tumbling Dice
13,652,752 brilliant posts
Currently Banned

Now what you want to avoid are the questions like 'hang on, why is TD banned?' which is fair enough and we all get why you don't think that content is helpful.  So continue the big stick approach with discussions of that nature.

But I think knowing that someone can't hear you when you talk to them is useful.

Cheers
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: m2 on December 30, 2016, 03:09:55 PM
Briscoe, I don't know if the forum is built to show that info to members -- i.e., if it's something we can turn on or off. Can look into it, and if it does allow it, mods can discuss. Thx.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: briscoetheque on December 30, 2016, 03:11:29 PM
No worries - one way may be in the section where on my profile it currently says R-E-S-T-E-C-P. I think that's a free text field. But not sure if even mods can change that field without a direct DB update.

Thanks, discuss away, feel free to close this thread now.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: an tha on December 30, 2016, 03:21:00 PM
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Briscoe - a good example of self regulation and I'm not going to comment on individual bans

Forum members get banned for a variety of reasons including because they been reported by fellow forum members. Personally I don't see the merit in publicising when a ban has been enforced. The focus should be on working within the rules of the forum so we dont need bans or sanctions. Support the community by self regulation but also simply dont put yourselves in that position in the first place where a ban or sanction needs to be considered.

with all due it is the highly subjective manner of what earns a ban and subsequent issues with consistency i have an issue with....for example i have been threatened quite clearly with a permanent ban next time i 'cross line' despite that ban should it occur being only my 2nd ever on here........how many members have had numerous temp bans?


See the point about consistency/fairness?
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: m2 on December 30, 2016, 03:32:11 PM
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No worries - one way may be in the section where on my profile it currently says R-E-S-T-E-C-P. I think that's a free text field. But not sure if even mods can change that field without a direct DB update.

Thanks, discuss away, feel free to close this thread now.


Just went through all the admin functions and there's nothing that allows us to show the public when a member has been banned. Sorry.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: briscoetheque on December 30, 2016, 03:32:59 PM
OK.
Title: Re: Bannings
Post by: m2 on December 30, 2016, 03:51:02 PM
Quote
with all due it is the highly subjective manner of what earns a ban and subsequent issues with consistency i have an issue with....for example i have been threatened quite clearly with a permanent ban next time i 'cross line' despite that ban should it occur being only my 2nd ever on here........how many members have had numerous temp bans?

Forum rules have said this for the past few years: Moderation by its very nature is subjective. We promise to apply these rules as fairly as possible to all members. However, our primary goal will always be to preserve and develop a civil community, and we'll ban for any reason and at any time members that get in the way of that goal.

You seem to think that "fair" means treating everyone the same. That's wrong. Fair means treating everyone how they deserve.

And with that, I'll close this thread per Briscoe's wise suggestion.