Author Topic: Can the rules be more specific?  (Read 6634 times)

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Offline soapit

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #45 on: January 01, 2014, 10:07:15 PM »
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I'm just glad the mods and M2 let us chime in on suggestions for the new rules. If you didn't contribute anything, you have nothing to complain about. Like they said, this isn't a democracy, they DID NOT HAVE to let us give any feedback at all. However I think that Matt believes in doing things right and giving a fair shake which has to be a reason why the atu2.com website has been so successful. It's the people here that make it great (plus this great band called U2). I say we focus on the band we all love and stop the toxicity that has developed around here.

We are people born of sound, the songs are in our eyes.

Miami66

to be honest i never even heard it was under discussion

Offline Blue Silken Sky

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #46 on: January 01, 2014, 10:15:28 PM »
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My policy from now on is just to ignore the very few idiots who I feel drag the forum down.
Hey, deja vu...

Hey Whooooooosh Express  :P
Day = made!

Hawkmoon2e

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #47 on: January 02, 2014, 12:30:43 AM »
Well, I guess you guys really do care. I'm touched.

But seriously, a few months ago m2 put a call out in the forum for new moderators. It was done this way because we want moderators that have been a part of the forum. In fact, all of the mods we have were hired in this same way. And some of us (me) have been on the wrong side of the forum rules prior to joining the team. I call that grace. And a little grace goes both ways. None of us think we're curing cancer here, but we also know that we don't want this place to be some car crash that everyone wants to look at, but no one wants to be involved in. If I, and probably most of you, walked into a bar or restaurant and saw a sign that said "Rules: Don't be a d**k", you'd probably laugh and agree with it. But it doesn't mean you can't debate. It's just how you debate is part of what we're interested in. But to think that this is all part of some New Year's resolution for the forum, and will soon die out; well, that's just false. Really guys, it ain't hard. A little thought goes a long way... or something like that anyway.

And the analogy with comparing this place to a public park doesn't mean that you'd talk and be friendly with everyone in the park. It means that you wouldn't show up in the park and take a leak on the slide, throw your trash on the lawn, and then push kids off the swings. (At least I hope you wouldn't.)

Offline m2

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #48 on: January 02, 2014, 12:43:31 AM »
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The take it or leave it attitude is not a way to build a healthy community either.

If it helps get rid of the people that consider it a sport to run roughshod over other members of the community, it'll be a great way to build community.

welcome to the internet

If it's not obvious yet, our expectation is that the conversation and level of civility in this forum will far exceed what happens elsewhere on the internet. Surely we can do better. And we will.

Offline m2

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #49 on: January 02, 2014, 12:46:23 AM »
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I'm just glad the mods and M2 let us chime in on suggestions for the new rules. If you didn't contribute anything, you have nothing to complain about. Like they said, this isn't a democracy, they DID NOT HAVE to let us give any feedback at all. However I think that Matt believes in doing things right and giving a fair shake which has to be a reason why the atu2.com website has been so successful. It's the people here that make it great (plus this great band called U2). I say we focus on the band we all love and stop the toxicity that has developed around here.

We are people born of sound, the songs are in our eyes.

Miami66

to be honest i never even heard it was under discussion

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Offline Tumbling Dice

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #50 on: January 02, 2014, 09:48:59 AM »
For what itís worth, I agree with the Mods approach of formulating and putting in place general guidelines which govern conduct rather than legislating in too much detail, even though they have a lawyer on the firm in Droo whose expertise they could have handily called upon. Too many rules and regulations and itíll start to resemble the European Union more than a fan forum.  Itís reasonable to expect us to self-regulate or self-moderate our conduct and appeal to our sense of whatís appropriate behaviour in different circumstances, so as to minimise the need for the Mods to intervene in what are quite often little more than squabbles that one would expect to find in a Kindergarten playground.  These new guidelines highlight the principles and the spirit in which the Mods - and most of us, I would hope - want the forum to blaze a trail in: a forum of thoughtful and civil discussion and a warm and good natured community of U2 fans with an inclusive atmosphere fostering an open expression of opinions without fear or favour.  What we would only expect of a forum made up of fans of a band like U2.  As Bono said during a concert in Sarajevo ďTo be one, to be united is a great thing.  But to respect differences may be even a greater thing.Ē


Offline Droo

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #51 on: January 02, 2014, 11:53:06 AM »
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For what it’s worth, I agree with the Mods approach of formulating and putting in place general guidelines which govern conduct rather than legislating in too much detail, even though they have a lawyer on the firm in Droo whose expertise they could have handily called upon.


As a lawyer I don't make the rules, I just apply them. Creation of rules is the realm of the legislators. :P

Offline soapit

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #52 on: January 02, 2014, 01:39:53 PM »
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My policy from now on is just to ignore the very few idiots who I feel drag the forum down.

I think itís a sensible policy for a happier and more civil forum, especially if we can all manage to sing from the same hymn sheet in collectively sending the few idiots to Coventry.  This process would separate the wheat from the chaff and make it clearer to all and sundry which members of the forum are the genuine U2 fans amongst us and which are the agitators.  In pursuing the new Ďagenda for changeí there may be casualties, some members will fall at the fences as we go forward, clusters may fall at the Canal Turn, more at the Chair, and still even more at Becherís Brook, and that is regrettable, but the Mods should be careful not to throw the baby out with the bathwater.  But, in the final analysis, shaking out the membership may be a price worth paying to get a @U2 forum worthy of the name.



actually i think more active reporting may be a more effective way to go now the mods are juiced up.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2014, 01:46:52 PM by soapit »

Offline soapit

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #53 on: January 02, 2014, 01:45:29 PM »
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The take it or leave it attitude is not a way to build a healthy community either.

If it helps get rid of the people that consider it a sport to run roughshod over other members of the community, it'll be a great way to build community.

welcome to the internet

If it's not obvious yet, our expectation is that the conversation and level of civility in this forum will far exceed what happens elsewhere on the internet. Surely we can do better. And we will.

i think i may be derailing slightly from zootvs original point, apologies

Offline Tumbling Dice

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #54 on: January 02, 2014, 03:06:14 PM »
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For what itís worth, I agree with the Mods approach of formulating and putting in place general guidelines which govern conduct rather than legislating in too much detail, even though they have a lawyer on the firm in Droo whose expertise they could have handily called upon.


As a lawyer I don't make the rules, I just apply them. Creation of rules is the realm of the legislators. :P

But the legislators need lawyers to draft the statutes. :P


Offline missey

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #55 on: January 02, 2014, 07:02:18 PM »
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I'm afraid to post now. Feels like kindergarten , IMO. 

You're welcome to use another U2 fan forum, zootv. There are other options out there if you decide this isn't the type of community you want to help grow and be part of.

Ironically, one reason we've rewritten the rules is that a great many others have left the forum out of fear of posting, too. But not fear of violating any rule -- fear of being trampled and trashed by other users. That's no way to build a healthy community.

I think the new rules are great.  I haven't posted in a while just for that exact reason, "being trampled and trashed".  I've been a member of this forum from day 1 and the amount of trash talk lately has just been too much!  Thanks m2 and the moderators. 

from day 1 eh.

Correct.

Offline U2-obsessed and proud

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #56 on: January 02, 2014, 10:30:27 PM »
Rule change or not, most of us will continue to act like the respectful people we are. I'm looking forward to the cracking down on the vocal minority or idiots and getting this forum back to its glory days.

I used to LIVE here, basically. 2009-2011, you couldn't get me off of here unless you smashed my laptop.  Now that I've graduated college and am living the adult life, I don't have as much time as I used to, but I still love this place.  I've met some great people on here, people I've met in real life and people I've been in touch with for 3-5 years now.  I want this place to be as fun for everyone else as it has been for me.  Good stuff, mods. Applause.

surit87

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #57 on: January 03, 2014, 12:07:01 AM »
The acid test for the mods will be when U2's new album comes out, trust me. The negativity of a few will be overwhelming, as my experience with OL showed. But I hope there are many who're able to stay decent for the sake of the forum. I simply love this place because it's the only place (I live far from western civilization) where I can talk about U2. My best of luck to the mods.

Offline m2

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #58 on: January 03, 2014, 01:06:02 AM »
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The acid test for the mods will be when U2's new album comes out, trust me. The negativity of a few will be overwhelming, as my experience with OL showed. But I hope there are many who're able to stay decent for the sake of the forum. I simply love this place because it's the only place (I live far from western civilization) where I can talk about U2. My best of luck to the mods.

I think that'll be more of a test for the forum membership than for the mods. It's perfectly fine to not like the album and share that opinion in the forum. But the test will be how those folks do it. The parts in the rules where we mention

* Appreciation threads,
* posting an opinion as if it's fact, and
* posting the same thing over and over (beating dead horses)

certainly apply to discussions like that. It was a huge turn-off for some members and moderators during the Ordinary Love discussions to see some people posting a dozen times a day, day after day, that the song was awful. We're not gonna tolerate that. And we also won't tolerate people posting repeatedly how great something is, either. Beating a dead horse can be done with both negative and positive posts.

Hawkmoon2e

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Re: Can the rules be more specific?
« Reply #59 on: January 03, 2014, 01:54:20 AM »
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Rule change or not, most of us will continue to act like the respectful people we are.

You nailed it on the head. Truth is, this shouldn't change how many of you already interact with each other.