Author Topic: U2 have never felt more corporate....  (Read 31589 times)

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meximofo

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Re: U2 have never felt more corporate....
« Reply #210 on: January 27, 2015, 04:00:39 PM »
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the truth is that it does not climb the heights of previous U2 albums and, just as importantly, the excitement on offer from other active musicians. 
Not because you say "truth" in a random opinion will make it a fact.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2015, 05:07:36 PM by meximofo »

Offline JHook

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Re: U2 have never felt more corporate....
« Reply #211 on: January 27, 2015, 04:42:41 PM »
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the truth is that it does not climb the heights of previous U2 albums and, just as importantly, the excitement on offer from other active musicians. 
Not because you say "truth" to a random opinion will make it a fact.
+1

A very slippery concept, "truth."

Offline Blueyedboy

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Re: U2 have never felt more corporate....
« Reply #212 on: January 28, 2015, 01:37:57 AM »
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the truth is that it does not climb the heights of previous U2 albums and, just as importantly, the excitement on offer from other active musicians. 
Not because you say "truth" in a random opinion will make it a fact.

Yeah OK, if we are being pedantic then maybe I should have chosen my words more wisely but calling it a random opinion....really?  Is this album as good as AB, TJT etc?  Are U2 the most exciting band on the cuircuit?

In the spirit of a decent forum debate , feel free to disprove the opinions I have arrived at with the facts that you crave.

Offline JHook

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Re: U2 have never felt more corporate....
« Reply #213 on: January 28, 2015, 07:08:34 AM »
SOI is a very fine album, whose quality is consistent throughout, which I did not find to be the case with U2's 21st century output up until now. That's my opinion. It's not necessarily the truth. Which is why I didn't begin the sentence with "the truth is..." Carry on.

meximofo

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Re: U2 have never felt more corporate....
« Reply #214 on: January 28, 2015, 09:30:06 AM »
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the truth is that it does not climb the heights of previous U2 albums and, just as importantly, the excitement on offer from other active musicians. 
Not because you say "truth" in a random opinion will make it a fact.

Yeah OK, if we are being pedantic then maybe I should have chosen my words more wisely but calling it a random opinion....really?  Is this album as good as AB, TJT etc?  Are U2 the most exciting band on the cuircuit?

In the spirit of a decent forum debate , feel free to disprove the opinions I have arrived at with the facts that you crave.
Pedantic is to pass opinions as facts. I can't disprove opinions, but I do think that SOI is the most exciting album in 2014, and that it is as good as, say Pop or TUF. You can't prove me wrong, so that "truth" vanishes.
English is not my native language. I said "random opinion" but perhaps I should have said "any given opinion". I was not belittling  your opinion.

Offline Blueyedboy

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Re: U2 have never felt more corporate....
« Reply #215 on: January 28, 2015, 12:53:46 PM »
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the truth is that it does not climb the heights of previous U2 albums and, just as importantly, the excitement on offer from other active musicians. 
Not because you say "truth" in a random opinion will make it a fact.

Yeah OK, if we are being pedantic then maybe I should have chosen my words more wisely but calling it a random opinion....really?  Is this album as good as AB, TJT etc?  Are U2 the most exciting band on the cuircuit?

In the spirit of a decent forum debate , feel free to disprove the opinions I have arrived at with the facts that you crave.
Pedantic is to pass opinions as facts. I can't disprove opinions, but I do think that SOI is the most exciting album in 2014, and that it is as good as, say Pop or TUF. You can't prove me wrong, so that "truth" vanishes.
English is not my native language. I said "random opinion" but perhaps I should have said "any given opinion". I was not belittling  your opinion.

I have no intentions of proving anybody wrong, if you read my post in full you will see I was comparing SOI with U2s best (not the two albums you picked to suit your argument) to make a point that only the very best songs can generate their own hype whereas this collection needs a shove.

I was not even attempting to belittle SOI, just stating what I believe is a widely held perception that SOI is not the number one album in the U2 catalogue and the lack of activity has dampened enthusiasm.

Ps, ironically Being pedantic is to be overly concerned with minor detail.

Offline markreed

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Re: U2 have never felt more corporate....
« Reply #216 on: January 28, 2015, 03:44:25 PM »
I got the same feeling listening to SOI for the first time that I have had at every post 1999 album : a sense of disappointment, filled with a growing liking over time. Certainly SOI beats the willies out of All That You Can't Leave Behind and Dismantle, because even though the highs on those records were very high, the lows were very low as well. SOI is more consistent, though U2 have seemed to have forgotten how to sequence an album.

Offline Johnny Feathers

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Re: U2 have never felt more corporate....
« Reply #217 on: February 05, 2015, 07:02:22 AM »
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Its surprising to see tickets at the list price of $95 and $65 still available today for Chicago 4 and Boston 4 today. I understand the high priced seats not selling out but all the $95 and $65 seats should have been sold in the first hour. U2 played to nearly 180,000 people over 3 shows in Chicago last time and 140,000 at two shows in Boston. The four Chicago arena shows combined on this tour would only add up to a little less than 80,000 tickets and so would Boston's. Although I can't be sure based on this, it possibly suggest that demand for U2 has dramatically declined in North America since the last tour. Unfortunately the albums songs not getting much airplay on the radio is probably not helping things. If this is truly reflective of demand out there, I don't think U2 will be playing any stadiums in North America on this tour even when it comes back in 2016/2017.

I'm not sure what you mean by "dramatically declined".  I only know about Chicago, but they sold one show at Soldier Field during the first leg of 360.  During this tour--as well as Elevation and Vertigo--they sold 4 shows at the United Center.  I can't say how many empty seats there were at any of the concerts, though there certainly were some--they moved my seats for 360 to much better ones which were obviously empty, so I can't say it was completely sold out.  I'm not going to be surprised that the last show they sell may have a few more available tickets--with ticket costs being what they are, and having already sold 3 other shows, they may have simply maxed out the market.  But I don't know how any of this means "the sky is falling", or that public interest is.  They had no hits off the last album, and will probably have none off this one.  And still managed to sell boatloads of the most expensive tickets (not including VIP packages) I've ever seen.

Consider that 4 shows at this arena in Chicago is probably at most 76,000 tickets soldout. They sold 200,000 tickets in Chicago on 360 for three shows, two on the first leg, and one on the second leg. If only the high priced tickets were still available, I'd understand, but there are $95 and $65 tickets still available. This suggest that they would only be able to play one 360 show at this demand level rather than 3, or two of the reduced capacity popmart stadium shows. In fact, I think the demand level may have returned to where it was on popmart and yes, that is a dramatic decline from where they were on 360 tour, vertigo tour, and maybe even the elevation tour.

On both Vertigo and Elevation, they soldout 6 shows on each of those tours as fast as tickets could be sold. Here they are struggling to sell tickets after just putting four shows on sale. Unfortunately, and I hope I am wrong, but it feels like the new U2 fans of the 00s crossed U2 off their bucket list and are not going this time, and some U2 fans in their 40s have retired from going to concerts, leaving an old core of fans about the size of the one that supported popmart. I'm not saying this is for sure, because so few cities are being played, but the data from Chicago and Boston suggest this as well as LA and San Jose/Oakland/San Francisco bay area.

I think this confirms that U2 are still very dependent on having hits in order to maintain the size of the concert going audience. The idea that they are now a heritage act that will sellout anything no matter what with or without hits or even no album is likely false.

The six shows you're talking about on Elevation and Vertigo were each split.  Four shows on the first leg, 2 shows on the return leg, months later.  They never sold 6 shows at once here.  As it stands, maybe these shows aren't selling quite as quickly as those tours, but there are a few factors:

1. Vertigo and Elevation each had hits.  They haven't had a hit since 2004.

2. Look at the ticket prices.  I'll let someone else do the research, but I know I just paid nearly double the price for a 200-level seat as I did for the most expensive Vertigo ticket.  Which means, where I once bought tickets to two of the initial four Vertigo/Elevation shows, I'm buying one.  Price is a factor.  (As is my declining interest in big arena shows and U2's recent work, admittedly.)

Nevertheless, I don't see what the fuss is about here.  I would need to see some actual sales numbers before I concluded that somehow U2 is experiencing any sort of significant decline.

     Well, you know that U2 played 3 stadium shows each to almost 70,000 people on the last tour in Chicago. The United Center in Chicago does not hold more than 20,000 for a single show. Ticket sales seem to have stalled after putting just four arena shows on sale. Four arena shows is barely enough to equal one 360 stadium show.

There are plenty of $95 and $65 priced seats available for Chicago 4 which went on sale yesterday. That there is the key indication that ticket sales have stalled early and demand is dramatically lower than it was on the last tour. U2 sold 200,000 tickets at an average price of $95 dollars on the last tour and now with less than 80,000 tickets available they are unable to sell hundreds of tickets at the $95 and $65 price levels.

What was the list price of the ticket you purchased by the way, before ticket surcharge fees are added in?

Also, Madison Square Garden in New York, the 6th show has some $95 and $65 tickets available. They soldout 10 arena shows in record time in the New York City area on the Vertigo Tour. Now they are starting to see slow sales at average ticket prices at show #6. They sold 250,000 tickets on the 360 tour for three shows, but are already seeing softer demand after putting just 120,000 tickets on sale on this tour. Once again, this feels like popmart demand levels.

You're conflating the total number of shows for the tour with the number for each leg again. The only played Soldier Field twice on the first U.S. Leg. And we would need representative numbers for initial vs. total tickets sold for this and past tours to compare them.

I paid $275 for my ticket for this show. The most paid/best seat I had for Vertigo was $165, I think.

You may ultimately be right, and ticket sales may not quite reach some other tours. But so far they have the same number of shows in Chicago, in the same venue, as both Elevation and Vertigo. So I don't see a big drop off yet.

     Well, the four Chicago shows on the first leg of Elevation and Vertigo were all instant sellouts within an hour of going on sell as I recall. There some ticket drops later, but you reached a point within the first day for each show where there were no longer any tickets available. Plus on the last tour 360, they sold 135,000 tickets for the two shows on the first leg. Just based on that, the current 80,000 tickets available for four shows should have been soldout by now. To me, it seems that if you put this ticket demand in a 360 context, they would only be able to do one show of 68,000 in Chicago instead of the two they did, and eventually three with the addition of the second leg. This suggest that demand is down by 50% at least from where it was on 360.

In general, if you can sellout a single stadium show of 70,000 in one day, you should be able to sellout 4 20,000 seat arena shows in one day as well. The arena shows are easier to sell because they take place on different nights giving fans multiple options to go see the show based on their schedule as well as giving more dedicated fans the option to see two, three, or four shows. Selling out a single stadium show with 70,000 capacity on one night is a tougher hill to climb than selling out out four much smaller arena shows.

Just an update: they added a fifth show to Chicago.  I don't know if they'll revisit on a return leg--I assume they will--but for what it's worth, the most they had done previously was 4 shows per leg on Elevation and Vertigo.  So I don't think there's any real decline happening--even if they aren't topping the charts as they used to.

Offline lemonPOP

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Re: U2 have never felt more corporate....
« Reply #218 on: February 09, 2015, 02:07:08 PM »
Found this to be interesting.   My wife was cleaning our basement out when she happened upon our 2005 vertigo salt lake city tickets.   I was curious of the price I paid with all the talk about ticket sales for the upcoming tour and found I paid 95 us dollars plus tax for upper bowl tickets from ticket master.  Nearly to the penny the same for upper bowl to the upcoming phoenix show. The lower level I don't know but I guess the price is not to bad after all. Also it looks like my current tickets are a bit better too.

Offline ZooClothes

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Re: U2 have never felt more corporate....
« Reply #219 on: February 09, 2015, 09:07:43 PM »
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Found this to be interesting.   My wife was cleaning our basement out when she happened upon our 2005 vertigo salt lake city tickets.   I was curious of the price I paid with all the talk about ticket sales for the upcoming tour and found I paid 95 us dollars plus tax for upper bowl tickets from ticket master.  Nearly to the penny the same for upper bowl to the upcoming phoenix show. The lower level I don't know but I guess the price is not to bad after all. Also it looks like my current tickets are a bit better too.
I've never paid more than 100 a ticket, fees included, for a U2 show, starting with PopMart. I've had GA and upper level seats. I consider it a bargain.

Offline Parsons

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Re: U2 have never felt more corporate....
« Reply #220 on: February 09, 2015, 10:06:35 PM »
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Found this to be interesting.   My wife was cleaning our basement out when she happened upon our 2005 vertigo salt lake city tickets.   I was curious of the price I paid with all the talk about ticket sales for the upcoming tour and found I paid 95 us dollars plus tax for upper bowl tickets from ticket master.  Nearly to the penny the same for upper bowl to the upcoming phoenix show. The lower level I don't know but I guess the price is not to bad after all. Also it looks like my current tickets are a bit better too.
I've never paid more than 100 a ticket, fees included, for a U2 show, starting with PopMart. I've had GA and upper level seats. I consider it a bargain.
+1 .
" I call it a bargain , the best I ever had
   the best I ever haaaaaaaaaaaaaad " !
« Last Edit: February 09, 2015, 10:16:53 PM by Parsons »