Author Topic: Bono's new character has an official name  (Read 5830 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline tigerfan41

  • Child of Grace
  • **
  • Posts: 1,780
  • 2017 Concerts: Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Detroit
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #15 on: June 04, 2017, 10:06:05 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
It's impressive how Bono can quote a passage from Wise Blood word for word. He has an almost eidectic memory with literature and poetry. Yet on stage, when singing a song he's sung a thousand times...

Unless he emailed the answers to RS and googled.
he's got ADHD undiagnosed I'm sure.  We can hyper focus and remember random things that are of interest to us.  Then not know our own phone number
Yes...my guy remembers every line from every book, every movie, every song...but he can't remember me sometimes. lol

Yup, it's textbook ADHD. It's incredible what random stuff I can hyper focus on and remember exactly, but then I'm totally flighty and might not remember what I came into the room to get. Sometimes the hyper focus can be a huge advantage; other times, it's more of a disadvantage (like spending hours researching random stuff but not wanting to study for a big test).

The best way I've found of explaining ADHD to someone who doesn't have it is imagine your brain is computer browser. The average person might have one or two tabs (thoughts) open and competing for their attention. Someone with ADHD would have dozens of tabs (thoughts) open and CONSTANTLY competing for their attention. Sometimes we can hyper focus on one tab and memorize/master it in a way that the average person can't. Interestingly, ADHD medicine (like Adderall) gives the average person a "high" but those with ADHD merely experience a "slow down" of thoughts--like all the browser tabs but one or two are closed and we can focus on just those one or two, much like an average person can do normally, every day.

Anyway, in observing Bono, I wouldn't be surprised if he's got a mild case of ADHD. Some of the most creative, gifted people have it. The fact that he seems to have so many different interests (music, art, charitable endeavors etc.) that he's passionate about is a dead give away as ADHD people tend to get bored with just 1-2 activities, so they need lots of different stimulation and tend to pick up lots of different things. All goes hand in hand with that whole "dozens of tabs open" thing.  ;)

Offline JTNash

  • Numb
  • **
  • Posts: 976
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #16 on: June 04, 2017, 11:03:24 AM »
And being a talker it's part of it for some of is.  I am not good at all with stimulants but do great with an SNRI.  Even with help still don't like to sit still or only do one thing.

Offline xy

  • Child of Grace
  • **
  • Posts: 1,548
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #17 on: June 04, 2017, 11:48:04 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
It's impressive how Bono can quote a passage from Wise Blood word for word. He has an almost eidectic memory with literature and poetry. Yet on stage, when singing a song he's sung a thousand times...

Unless he emailed the answers to RS and googled.

He's read the book recently in preparation for the character.

Offline tigerfan41

  • Child of Grace
  • **
  • Posts: 1,780
  • 2017 Concerts: Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Detroit
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #18 on: June 04, 2017, 12:12:29 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
And being a talker it's part of it for some of is.  I am not good at all with stimulants but do great with an SNRI.  Even with help still don't like to sit still or only do one thing.

Yeah, I like to say no medicine is a 100% fix, often it's a balancing act of finding what works and balancing that out with other things (exercise, diet, artistic outlets). In my case it's been a 1-2 combo of a stimulant and an anti-anxiety (SSRI) medicine that works best. Even then, I'm still a little too ambitious, a little too active, but slightly less so.

Offline il_capo

  • Child of Grace
  • **
  • Posts: 1,623
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #19 on: June 04, 2017, 01:18:51 PM »
This is a very interesting discussion, but I am not sure it's helpful to label Bono as having ADHD or trying to think about individuals in terms of personality disorders.  Surely we're all on the spectrum of human behaviours/character types and I don't want to pathologise some forms of behaviour that aren't considered to be "neuro-typical".  What is typical anyway, and who gets to define it?   Anti-depressants can literally be life savers in cases of extreme depression, but they're not a long term solution.  I like this comment from Ian Svenonius from when he was in the Make-Up:

The smallest children in the U.S. are being diagnosed with attention deficit disorder and prescribed Ritalin by the pharmaceutical Big Brother. Everyone else takes Prozac. The pharmaceutical juggernaut, in the spirit of capitalist psychology, ignores context and society in its diagnosis, and pretends that depression etc, stems entirely from brain chemistry. With the masses opiated in this manner, a revolutionary must abstain, from perhaps the most psychedelic experience of all.

Offline tigerfan41

  • Child of Grace
  • **
  • Posts: 1,780
  • 2017 Concerts: Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Detroit
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #20 on: June 04, 2017, 05:18:55 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
This is a very interesting discussion, but I am not sure it's helpful to label Bono as having ADHD or trying to think about individuals in terms of personality disorders.  Surely we're all on the spectrum of human behaviours/character types and I don't want to pathologise some forms of behaviour that aren't considered to be "neuro-typical".  What is typical anyway, and who gets to define it?   Anti-depressants can literally be life savers in cases of extreme depression, but they're not a long term solution.  I like this comment from Ian Svenonius from when he was in the Make-Up:

The smallest children in the U.S. are being diagnosed with attention deficit disorder and prescribed Ritalin by the pharmaceutical Big Brother. Everyone else takes Prozac. The pharmaceutical juggernaut, in the spirit of capitalist psychology, ignores context and society in its diagnosis, and pretends that depression etc, stems entirely from brain chemistry. With the masses opiated in this manner, a revolutionary must abstain, from perhaps the most psychedelic experience of all.

You're definitely right, anti-depressants aren't a long term solution--many times they cease to be effective after a certain period of time or, worse, do chemical damage that isn't easily reversed. It's also worth mentioning that no pill is a quick fix, often it's a combination of therapy, exercise, diet, medication, activities etc. that works well for someone suffering from, say, depression, anxiety, ADHD etc.

ADHD is definitely not a personality disorder (in the traditional sense), although personality disorders and ADHD can go hand in hand. There's an ADHD/human behavior spectrum that everyone fits on somewhere. Most are on the non-ADHD side, some are on it slightly, others are way on it. A good many who are on the spectrum don't use medication to cope, rather they use other coping mechanisms (such as therapy or a strict routine). There's actually a lot of people who are never formally diagnosed but absolutely have the classic ADHD symptoms and perhaps manage to harness things like hyper focus to accomplish things. I was one of them in college.

I think it's important, too, that ADHD and similar conditions be de-stigmatized. Having one doesn't mean there's something wrong with you, it just means that your brain is wired a little differently than others and it's entirely possible to use that to your advantage in things like creative pursuits.

Offline JTNash

  • Numb
  • **
  • Posts: 976
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #21 on: June 04, 2017, 10:01:51 PM »
In my case there is no other solution and it is a long term solution. My brain needs serotonin and norepinephrine.  I'll never make enough of those chemicals or hormones whatever they are.  I'm not anxious because I have lots of things to worry about and I just need to talk it out.  It's illogical and not real it's a broken brain.  My treatment could change but this is a real thing it's not a scam made by pharmaceutical companies, if you think they you don't need meds ands that's wonderful, but some of us do.

Offline il_capo

  • Child of Grace
  • **
  • Posts: 1,623
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #22 on: June 05, 2017, 03:16:34 PM »
I spoke to a pharmacologist once, who informed me that Prozac permanently alters brain chemistry, in which case it should only be taken in extreme circumstances.  It used to be prescribed so commonly in the UK, I don’t know about America. 

I most certainly don’t want to appear to be criticising anyone for taking anti-depressants or anti-anxiety medication which are often absolutely vital for survival and for people being able to live functional lives.  I have seen people in horrific psychic agony, and for whom nothing but anti-depressants could provide relief.   However, even these individuals told me that they craved a longer term course of psychotherapy (talking therapies) once the medication had stabilised them.  Psychotherapy is a lengthy process and only the wealthy can afford it, alas.

Definitely agree with tigerfan on the importance of activities such as exercise to the treatment of depression.  And it’s vitally important to de-stigmatise depression and other forms of mental illness.  I think much progress has been made in this regard in recent decades.  But I don’t want to get too caught up in definitions because we all exist on “the spectrum” – Bono, Larry, you and me.  Our idiosyncratic forms of humanity should be celebrated and be allowed to flourish in society.

Offline JTNash

  • Numb
  • **
  • Posts: 976
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #23 on: June 05, 2017, 03:35:30 PM »
Um no, you can't talk your way out of something irrational.  It's not happening because your sad and need to cheer up or just need life skills.  All thoes attitudes are part of a stigma around depression that somehow if they just try harder they will be happy and less anxious.  Not True. Maybe people who need help would get it more if there were not people spreading the myth that they just need to talk to someone and they will be cured.

Would you ask a diabetic not to take insulin and just talk about making their pancreas to function?

Offline JTNash

  • Numb
  • **
  • Posts: 976
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #24 on: June 05, 2017, 03:36:54 PM »
Music alters your brain, trauma alters your brain and abuse alters your brain too

Offline il_capo

  • Child of Grace
  • **
  • Posts: 1,623
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #25 on: June 05, 2017, 04:26:39 PM »
I am not sure that depression is always irrational, but certainly for some people it can be caused by a chemical imbalance that can be treated with medication.  The problem is when we say something is irrational we may deny someone’s experience: if someone is depressed because they’ve been abused, does it help to tell them their depression and anxiety is irrational?  I think the brain is a far more complex organ than a pancreas, and that we’re predominantly social beings, so that paying attention to social context and the integration of the individual into her/his community is important when considering depression/anxiety.  But certainly think there is an important place for medication in acute cases, and in cases of permanent chemical imbalance where it is necessary long term. 

Offline riffraff

  • Deep In the Heart
  • ****
  • Posts: 26,226
  • I know that this is not goodbye, my forum friends!
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #26 on: June 05, 2017, 04:37:10 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
I am not sure that depression is always irrational, but certainly for some people it can be caused by a chemical imbalance that can be treated with medication.  The problem is when we say something is irrational we may deny someone’s experience: if someone is depressed because they’ve been abused, does it help to tell them their depression and anxiety is irrational?  I think the brain is a far more complex organ than a pancreas, and that we’re predominantly social beings, so that paying attention to social context and the integration of the individual into her/his community is important when considering depression/anxiety.  But certainly think there is an important place for medication in acute cases, and in cases of permanent chemical imbalance where it is necessary long term.
I had to take anti-anxiety meds for a while, a long time ago. I took them until I got my feet back under me. I also saw a psychologist, and I think, for me, talking to her was better than anything else. Each case is so different. If someone had told me that my depression and anxiety were irrational, I would have gotten MAJORLY irrational on them. Just saying...

Offline an tha

  • Airborne Ranger
  • ***
  • Posts: 9,430
  • You can swallow, or you can spit.
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #27 on: June 05, 2017, 04:57:34 PM »
 
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Um no, you can't talk your way out of something irrational.  It's not happening because your sad and need to cheer up or just need life skills.  All thoes attitudes are part of a stigma around depression that somehow if they just try harder they will be happy and less anxious.  Not True. Maybe people who need help would get it more if there were not people spreading the myth that they just need to talk to someone and they will be cured.

Would you ask a diabetic not to take insulin and just talk about making their pancreas to function?

Everyone is of course different but it sounds like you are dismissing what might work for some and maybe hasn't worked for you.....whilst understandable i feel that is a little off.

There are a number of things that are proven to help with some/many depressed and anxious people - talking and listening are of course among them.

Of course it varies greatly from person to person...i would imagine that for a lot of people no one thing alone is enough whether it is medication or talking, combinations of things such as exercise, talking, setting goals, diet, sleep, routines, taking on new things and or medication seem to make a difference for many. The most important thing of course is that the person suffering finds the best thing to help them - I am of the view that being as open as possible to all options/trying mixes and different combinations is a good idea.

I know someone for example who suffered/suffers massively who is a huge believer in something called 'Mindfulness' after being introduced to it by a highly qualified specialist and was able to come off medication because of it and now feels better than has in years........not saying this works for everyone but it works for that person.

I sort of felt from your post that you seem closed to other things that may help apart from meds or think you can't improve without them.....all i am saying is maybe that is not true for everyone??..

It is a very complex thing we are discussing here and none of us are (as far as i know) specialists - that said there is a lot of evidence that talking about things and listening and being as open as possible with what you say and as receptive as possible to what others say helps....as of course do meds etc etc etc.

I read recently a piece about good new experiences and how can help depression....When we challenge ourselves to do something differently for example there are chemical changes that happen in the brain - the brain alters in a positive manner just as it alters in a negative manner due to abuse etc.....trying something new alters the levels of the brain chemical dopamine a chemical which is associated with pleasure, enjoyment, and learning.

Of course nobody is 'right' to tell anyone else just do this or that and it will be better but equally nobody is necessarily 'right' to just dismiss stuff either.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2017, 05:14:53 PM by an tha »

Offline il_capo

  • Child of Grace
  • **
  • Posts: 1,623
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #28 on: June 05, 2017, 05:47:55 PM »
I've always been distrustful of "mindfulness" due to an irrational prejudice at the name of the therapy, but I read something interesting about it that made me see the potential value in it: that mindfulness identifies a fight, flight, freeze sequence in our behaviour. 1.  the individual will fight (assault, attack, demean an individual they feel threatened by), 2. he or she then experiences flight (cuts-off, shuns, and dehumanises that person), and 3. they freeze (dissociate or become rigidly fixed in an intractable position).  This is a tragic sequence and results in blame replacing communication and knowledge: blame being what fills the void left by the refusal to try to understand the other person, and thereby refusing to learn to understand ourselves better as well.

Offline riffraff

  • Deep In the Heart
  • ****
  • Posts: 26,226
  • I know that this is not goodbye, my forum friends!
Re: Bono's new character has an official name
« Reply #29 on: June 05, 2017, 05:52:21 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
I've always been distrustful of "mindfulness" due to an irrational prejudice at the name of the therapy, but I read something interesting about it that made me see the potential value in it: that mindfulness identifies a fight, flight, freeze sequence in our behaviour. 1.  the individual will fight (assault, attack, demean an individual they feel threatened by), 2. he or she then experiences flight (cuts-off, shuns, and dehumanises that person), and 3. they freeze (dissociate or become rigidly fixed in an intractable position).  This is a tragic sequence and results in blame replacing communication and knowledge: blame being what fills the void left by the refusal to try to understand the other person, and thereby refusing to learn to understand ourselves better as well.
Interesting...I wonder how the therapy is applied to an individual.