Poll

Do you believe in God?

Yes
58 (65.2%)
No
31 (34.8%)

Total Members Voted: 82

Voting closed: April 04, 2009, 03:05:22 PM

Author Topic: U2.... God... Believe...  (Read 30779 times)

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shockdocta22

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #465 on: April 27, 2009, 06:44:42 PM »
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Let Us make man in Our image = Father/Son/Holy Ghost. Read John 1, it backs that up. Kewl huh......

Not really

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*mind explodes from the on an on circle*

it reminds me of this

The below statement is false
The above statement is true

Bobo

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #466 on: April 27, 2009, 07:43:06 PM »
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Let Us make man in Our image = Father/Son/Holy Ghost. Read John 1, it backs that up. Kewl huh......

Not really

visitors can't see pics , please You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login or You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login


*mind explodes from the on an on circle*

it reminds me of this

The below statement is false
The above statement is true

11k posts? is that correct?

Offline JuniorEmblem

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #467 on: April 27, 2009, 07:48:51 PM »
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Let Us make man in Our image = Father/Son/Holy Ghost. Read John 1, it backs that up. Kewl huh......

Not really

visitors can't see pics , please You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login or You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login


*mind explodes from the on an on circle*

it reminds me of this

The below statement is false
The above statement is true

11k posts? is that correct?

now there's a miracle I can believe in......maybe.....11K ???????.......jeez......




shockdocta22

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #468 on: April 27, 2009, 07:50:19 PM »
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Let Us make man in Our image = Father/Son/Holy Ghost. Read John 1, it backs that up. Kewl huh......

Not really

visitors can't see pics , please You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login or You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login


*mind explodes from the on an on circle*

it reminds me of this

The below statement is false
The above statement is true

11k posts? is that correct?

now there's a miracle I can believe in......maybe.....11K ???????.......jeez......





at least im not online for 22+ days ;)

Offline JuniorEmblem

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #469 on: April 27, 2009, 07:54:20 PM »
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at least im not online for 22+ days ;)


yeah, but I'll leave my computers on all night sometimes, I'll be logged in for hours at a time

80 posts a day, don't they give homework anymore ?

 :)
« Last Edit: April 27, 2009, 08:06:45 PM by JuniorEmblem »

Revolver7

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #470 on: April 27, 2009, 07:54:35 PM »
That Circular Logic is very prevalent here in the South East United States... :D

What I wonder is, if Jesus had wanted to write something down, wouldn't he have done it himself?

shockdocta22

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #471 on: April 27, 2009, 07:58:34 PM »
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11k posts? is that correct?

now there's a miracle I can believe in......maybe.....11K ???????.......jeez......




[/quote]

at least im not online for 22+ days ;)
[/quote]


yeah, but I'll leave my computers on all night sometimes, I'll be logged in for hours at a time

80 posts a day, don't they give homework anymore ?

 :)
[/quote]

I do the same thing :D

Bobo

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #472 on: April 27, 2009, 08:01:05 PM »
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That Circular Logic is very prevalent here in the South East United States... :D

What I wonder is, if Jesus had wanted to write something down, wouldn't he have done it himself?

He did...read John 1.  :D Please read it, it will explain a lot.

Revolver7

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #473 on: April 27, 2009, 08:09:27 PM »
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That Circular Logic is very prevalent here in the South East United States... :D

What I wonder is, if Jesus had wanted to write something down, wouldn't he have done it himself?

He did...read John 1.  :D Please read it, it will explain a lot.

I hope you're joking  ;)

I had to go to Catholic School for 6 years. It was certainly interesting! Mass 3 times a week...I've heard a lot of stuff  :D

I consider myself a christian with zen and buddhist influences. I know Atheists, and I understand their perspective perfectly. I don't believe in organized religion myself, and I believe that the Bible is just what man wrote. I don't believe it to be the word of God, and I don't believe that God told people what to put in it.

That's just what I believe though...I could be wrong

Offline aarond

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #474 on: April 27, 2009, 08:16:39 PM »
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That Circular Logic is very prevalent here in the South East United States... :D

What I wonder is, if Jesus had wanted to write something down, wouldn't he have done it himself?

I'm a Christian, but don't believe the bible infallible. I think most Christians ascribe to that view but as with any group, the most outspoken people gain recognition for the group, not those who make up the majority. I know a lot of atheists that are great people, but then I find the (not accusing anybody in the forum of this) occasional overpassionate one who has decided it is his mission to disprove something that is neither provable nor unprovable and destroy the world view of as many "religious idiots" as possible.

Very few people wrote anything down in first century middle eastern culture...oral teaching was much more valued. But if he had written anything, would people debate his being the son of God any less? Doubtful.

Offline ITM

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #475 on: April 27, 2009, 09:36:36 PM »
Quote
It's not real! OMG (oh my gourd!)! I'm open to the possibility of the whold Bible thing being real but this video is not convincing in any way! I can't believe that you, who seems to be intelligent though in possession of a little too much Frasier Crane, would fall for such a thing.  And eye witness testimony for these things, like with many UFO incidents, is often unreliable and unaware of the real reasons for the phenomena.   

Absent 1990's, twenty-first century level a/v technology, more than the video is considered in weighing the evidence as credible. Namely, those eye witness testimonies. As unreliable as some incidents may track, like those in potential UFO sightings, it is difficult to consider a two-year phenomena, viewed by five hundred thousand to one million witnesses that included scientists, atheists, lawyers and physicians as being reasonably characterized as "unreliable".

You're certainty is misplaced. The event meets credible standards of evidence beyond a reasonable doubt. Unless of course that is you have something more than confidence and a vegetable to offer.

It's good to hear you're open to the possibility of those claims held in The Holy Bible.

Quote
Re. the "non-fiction novel", "In Cold Blood" is not the first or best novel of that type - and if it is not "popular fiction" (which you infer is my frame of reference becuase another member of this board mentioned someone using the Da Vinci Code - an awful book - as a reference book) then I don't know what is.  However, it would be a mistake for anyone to use a non-fiction novel as a solid refernce for factual events because things get changed during the creative process.

 I didn't mention that it was the first nor the best, simply that it is an example of something you claimed didn't exist. I encourage you to familiarize yourself with genre. It wouldn't necessarily be a mistake for someone to use a non-fiction novel as a solid reference for factual events given that non-fiction novel uses factual events and references to fuel it's narrative, albeit within a creative process.

 At any rate...

 
Quote
You do not believe, or don't want to believe that Jesus is A) a composite of mythological figures from around the world, who all represent and teach essentially the same thing (the coincidences are too many for it to definitively be accidental, and those same coincidences may be trying to teach us something very important) or B) that Jesus was real and attempted to teach us something very valuable about our selves and the nature of reality.  Fine, believe what you want, but there is no need to pretend like it is definitely true because there is no way of knowing.  Nothing has been proven in either way, and anything is possible so there is no point in anyone believing absolutely in something that has been created by other people (the Bible, the Church).  Not to say that god(s) doesn't exist, but the story that has been passed down...

 I don't believe the scenarios you or a number of others have put forth because the evidence doesn't support the claim. If you read my response, the obvious deficiencies begin with post-Christian start dates, rendering their inclusion as influencing Christianity impossible. They end with render influencing Christianity impossible by virtue of their ideological contrast.

 There is something else to consider. C.S.Lewis touches on this in his essay, "Myth Became Fact," where myths of one time or another of one people or another are taken at face value to be integral, but only when the claims of Christianity as fact arise, does incredulity become apparent and certain. Part of this consideration arises from Lewis's experience as an expert on myths, to which he says Christ is most certainly not a myth.

 I'm paraphrasing, and I'd love if someone started a thread on the subject, but should you desire further information, you have a starting point. Lewis was after all one the great atheists of the 20th century before he became one of it's greatest Christians.

 Concerning your point B), the answer to Christ's existence as fact is yes, there is "a way of knowing" and it's readily and easily accessible to anyone. Again, there are some fundamentals concerning standards of evidence, historicity, myth, etc...that you need to become familiar with in order to actually differentiate what's patently obvious to many that seems inconceivable to you. It's not exactly esoteric stuff.

Quote
If the God thing was demonstratably true, why are there so many non believers in the Christian god?  Any thing is possible, but that doesn't make it likely, and I have not been swayed by the arguments - and I spent 10 years in catholic school.  And how do you feel about Jews, Muslims, Raelians, Hindus and so on?  Do they need to be saved?  Were there dinosaurs or are they plaster constructions made by bored museum employees (some only have two real bones, wtf)? And this: Why does the creator say, in genesis, "let us make man in our image" is there is only one?

 A number of topics, jimmyjazz. Again, please start another thread and in so doing, resign your questions along a continuous topic rather than leapfrogging from one to another. I'd be happy to address each one in turn.

 As to how I feel about people, be they Jewish, Muslim, Atheist...I believe in precisely the quote you've referenced. That humanity as part of God's creation, bears a stamp of the Divine. That the dignity accorded to creation is something I should maintain in accordance to Biblical prescriptions. As it pertains to one person or another and their salvific end, I believe only God can convert a person's heart in so far as they are willing to receive God's grace towards that singular desire that seeks to know God fully and completely and know Him eternally.

 So do people need to be saved? According to Christ, yes. And because the claims and evidence concerning Christ, coupled with the provision of God's grace to endure despite my shortcomings, I defer to Christ's assertions. But in so far as Christ's message is indivisible from Christ Himself, so is His methodology. And this method seeks entrance into a person's life, not through dogma, but through love.

 As to the "why" God includes "us" and "our" within the identification of the singular. The obvious answer is because that is what He says Himself to be. It should also be taken as instrumental in identifying the Judaic origins of the concept of The Holy Trinity. There's other Scriptural justifications but perhaps I can answer in part the possibility of "how" by pointing to Quantum Mechanics as an appeal to the perspective you value above others...Bose-Einstein condensates.

Quote
Off to burn some witches and scientists. Later.

Like Dr. Francis Collins perhaps?

Revolver7

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #476 on: April 27, 2009, 09:39:18 PM »
Blind Faith is a fundamental part of the Christian religion...if you try to explain everything with the bible, then the faith is no longer blind (in my opinion)

Offline Mr. BonorFLYd

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #477 on: April 27, 2009, 11:05:04 PM »
"I believe I can fly. I believe I can touch the sky" - R. Kelly

*before he did inappropriate things with a 16 yr. old.

Offline TraKianLite/Zooropa

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Re: U2.... God... Believe...
« Reply #478 on: April 28, 2009, 09:45:24 AM »
Ah crap, I've been going through You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login again, and now I've pulled up a load of relevant ones.

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Anyway, carry on...