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U2 => General U2 Discussion => Topic started by: georgemccauley on February 04, 2018, 02:47:28 AM

Title: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: georgemccauley on February 04, 2018, 02:47:28 AM
I have seen a few posts on Facebook from multiple people saying this and it appears to be gathering weight. I donít know the original source but more and more people are talking about it and saying it. I donít know if anyone knows about it on this forum or not but I thought Iíd mention it as itís worrying.

There is no U2 without Larry Mullen.
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: opening night on February 04, 2018, 07:30:56 AM
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I have seen a few posts on Facebook from multiple people saying this and it appears to be gathering weight. I donít know the original source ...

That says it all.
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: imaginary friend on February 04, 2018, 09:07:22 AM
Not long after NLOTH came out, I started a poll called "Wild speculation: Larry's replacement". It might be fun to dig up.   ;)
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: the_chief on February 04, 2018, 02:28:51 PM
https://twitter.com/SamanthaLibreri/status/954453755126321152

Looks happy here..
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: the_chief on February 04, 2018, 04:06:01 PM
Also, Bono said in a recent interview that Larry loved the JT tour but, is not sure if he loves some of the songs on SOE so, who is to know
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: MadRob360 on February 05, 2018, 04:42:43 AM
i call BS. Things that start on facebook tend to be...
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: Jono on February 05, 2018, 07:41:04 AM
and I call this a general discussion, don't you?
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: PROJ2823 on February 05, 2018, 10:43:15 AM
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Also, Bono said in a recent interview that Larry loved the JT tour but, is not sure if he loves some of the songs on SOE so, who is to know
Larry (and I guess also Adam and even to a lesser extent Edge) is probably not so happy with the way Bono chases commercial succes, working with pop producers.
But I do not think that he is tired of music or drumming, otherwise he would have recorded with Alice Cooper.
 
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: summerholly on February 05, 2018, 03:39:33 PM
Drumming is a pretty physical occupation and Larry has had issues so I guess there will come a time where he has had enough.  Who knows when that will be.
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: JaraSangASongAWeapon on February 06, 2018, 12:45:47 AM
Replace LMJ with the guy I heard at a guitar center in LA doing SBS drums...has a heavy metal look but so what?

jk
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: imaginary friend on February 06, 2018, 07:41:44 AM
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Replace LMJ with the guy I heard at a guitar center in LA doing SBS drums...has a heavy metal look but so what?

jk

If, by some tiny chance, this rumor becomes reality, the guy they need to steal is Eloy Casagrande from Sepultura. Dude's like 26 or 27 years old, and he won Guitar Center's Best Drummer Under 18 in Brazil when he was 14 years old. Here he is in his pre-Sepultura days; think he was 20 at the time of filming:    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R14XVBGUhzc

Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: DPardue on February 06, 2018, 09:43:18 AM
If if if this is true then U2 should close up shop. The band has been so tightly identified with the same four members for decades that losing Larry Mullen, the founder of the band no less, would be enough to call it a career for the entire band.  The last thing I want to see is for the band to usher in a younger drummer just to fill a void.  U2 minus Larry Mullen is not really U2 to me.
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: Billy Rhythm on February 06, 2018, 10:37:13 AM
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If if if this is true then U2 should close up shop.
Agreed...  He's every bit as much of their sound as the other three...  Not saying that they couldn't make good music without him, but it simply wouldn't be U2...  It'd be time for the others to explore solo projects if this is true...  U2 without Larry Mullen Jr. is The Beatles without Ringo, he's THAT integral to their sound...  Not putting a whole lotta stock into this anyway...  Still a Proud spacebook virgin...:-)
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: Vox on February 06, 2018, 10:58:30 AM
When the time comes that anyone in U2 wants to step away, the band needs to retire.  That's all there is to it.  Other bands can keep going in a piecemeal fashion.  Not this one.  That's part of what makes them who they are.  If they kept going without one of the four, I'd lose a tremendous amount of respect for them.

That being said, I'd be interested in seeing what each band member would do solo.  I always imagine Bono doing a loungey duets album.  Or The Edge making a crazy experimental album of strange sounds.  Or Adam and Larry coming together to do something sorta EDM like "Mission Impossible," or simply collaborate with other musicians.   
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: wons on February 06, 2018, 01:02:23 PM
Larry Mullen has actually stated that U2 could continue without Bono and sited AC/DC as an example. The Edge has also stated that the band would go one if one member left the group. Bono and Adam have not to my knowledge given an opinion on the topic.
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: ross_ander on February 06, 2018, 01:09:50 PM
If this was to happen.. I certainly would not be surprised. His disinterest in promoting the new album, Bono's comments about him disliking the album, etc.  In some cases he actually looks quite unhappy. Some people dismiss this on this forum (and on the atu2 podcast) as him just being grumpy as usual. I'm not so convinced. Retirement would be an understandable decision to focus on what is important in his life and moving on from something he is no longer artistically and emotionally connected with.
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: wons on February 06, 2018, 01:14:39 PM
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If this was to happen.. I certainly would not be surprised. His disinterest in promoting the new album, Bono's comments about him disliking the album, etc.  In some cases he actually looks quite unhappy. Some people dismiss this on this forum (and on the atu2 podcast) as him just being grumpy as usual. I'm not so convinced. Retirement would be an understandable decision to focus on what is important in his life and moving on from something he is no longer artistically and emotionally connected with.

Do you have a source for Bono saying that Larry disliked the new album?
Title: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: Luzita on February 06, 2018, 08:44:53 PM
I donít put much stock in this rumor. I wonder if it might be connected to the dreadful book I just read, U2: the Definitive Biography. Definitive B.S. is what it was, full of factual errors, malicious innuendo, and Bono-bashing. One of things it said was that Larry was going to retire after 2 more albums. No source cited (as was often the case). The book came out in 2014 but prior to SOI so maybe somebody thinks it is now 2 albums later.


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Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: the_chief on February 07, 2018, 02:24:36 AM
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If this was to happen.. I certainly would not be surprised. His disinterest in promoting the new album, Bono's comments about him disliking the album, etc.  In some cases he actually looks quite unhappy. Some people dismiss this on this forum (and on the atu2 podcast) as him just being grumpy as usual. I'm not so convinced. Retirement would be an understandable decision to focus on what is important in his life and moving on from something he is no longer artistically and emotionally connected with.

Do you have a source for Bono saying that Larry disliked the new album?

Dave Fanning interview.

Bono says that Larry loved the JT tour but, is not sure if he loves the album
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: The Bonzo on February 07, 2018, 08:42:27 AM
We also need to take into account LMJ's back issue, he is not getting any younger.

If he does decide to call it quits then we have to respect him.

in hindsight musically U2 are going nowhere their last 5 albums have been commercial flops
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: the_chief on February 07, 2018, 09:15:45 AM
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We also need to take into account LMJ's back issue, he is not getting any younger.

If he does decide to call it quits then we have to respect him.

in hindsight musically U2 are going nowhere their last 5 albums have been commercial flops

Commercial flops?

I see trolls even make it onto forums these days...
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: Luzita on February 07, 2018, 09:18:15 AM
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in hindsight musically U2 are going nowhere their last 5 albums have been commercial flops

That is nowhere close to true. ATYCLB and HTDAAB were big commercial successes, much bigger than Pop or Zooropa. NLOTH did okay, esp. considering it was released at a time when overall record sales were dropping. SOI canít be compared to other albums due to its unconventional release. And SOE has already sold over a million albums globally, which in the current environment is pretty decent.



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Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: the_chief on February 07, 2018, 09:31:58 AM
Noel Gallagher was interviewed recently. He said what he learned from U2 recently are the following:

Bono is the funniest guy ever
The Edge, when you look into his eyes, you can see his brain working overtime.
And, most importantly, Larry Mullen is the boss of the band.

Now, I don't know U2 personally but, if that's the case and this speculative rumour is true, then it's all over...

However, I tend to be cautious about believing this for many reasons.

The Edge recently said he would never want to do anything as a solo artist and needs the band.
Bono agreed.
Bono has said Larry loved the JT tour.
Larry, when asked in a recent interview, (think it was an Australian interview) said it was still fun and that it's important to have fun when doing this.
Bono also said he wasn't sure if Larry likes the song, The Showman....

That last line is important...If he was going to retire and wanted out, it would be a case of, "Yeah, whatever. Let's just get on with it and finish this"

Also, playing music, writing music, recording music...It's like a drug! The most addictive drug imaginable. You can't stop it! Even when bands break up, for personal reasons, those individuals just don't stop playing music. You can't help yourself!

My personal belief, I think they will slow down after this tour but, I don't think they'll ever finish completely. They can't, it's too addictive :D
Title: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: Luzita on February 07, 2018, 02:26:50 PM
I agree that if Larry quits then U2 is over, it just isnít U2 without all four of them. But theyíd continue to make music as individuals.


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Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: mariamontreal on February 07, 2018, 03:55:15 PM
Maybe they should let Larry choose the setlist and play what makes him happy instead After all he is the boss.Until we hear an official announcement from the band it's hear say.
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: Luzita on February 07, 2018, 04:01:05 PM
The source of the rumor is apparently this site:

https://en.mediamass.net/people/larry-mullen-jr/retirement.html

It has a note saying ďThis story appears to be false.Ē If you click on it you discover the site is a ďsatireĒ site. Not surprised this is B.S.


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Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: wons on February 07, 2018, 07:46:48 PM
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We also need to take into account LMJ's back issue, he is not getting any younger.

If he does decide to call it quits then we have to respect him.

in hindsight musically U2 are going nowhere their last 5 albums have been commercial flops

All That You Can't Leave Behind: sold over 12 million copies worldwide, one of the biggest selling albums of the 00s

How To Dismantle An Atomic Bomb: sold over 10 million copies worldwide,one of the biggest selling albums of the 00s

No Line On The Horizon: 7th biggest selling album of 2009 worldwide

Songs Of Innocence: released for free, but none of the songs do well on radio or streaming so this might be considered a flop

Songs Of Experience: Ok album sales for 2017/2018, but none of songs do well on radio or streaming. Maybe a flop, but debatable.

So, to sum up the last five albums include two of the most successful of U2's career. Another that was indeed successful at least for the year it was released, and only the last two that could be argued as flops.
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: the_chief on February 08, 2018, 12:14:52 AM
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We also need to take into account LMJ's back issue, he is not getting any younger.

If he does decide to call it quits then we have to respect him.

in hindsight musically U2 are going nowhere their last 5 albums have been commercial flops

All That You Can't Leave Behind: sold over 12 million copies worldwide, one of the biggest selling albums of the 00s

How To Dismantle An Atomic Bomb: sold over 10 million copies worldwide,one of the biggest selling albums of the 00s

No Line On The Horizon: 7th biggest selling album of 2009 worldwide

Songs Of Innocence: released for free, but none of the songs do well on radio or streaming so this might be considered a flop

Songs Of Experience: Ok album sales for 2017/2018, but none of songs do well on radio or streaming. Maybe a flop, but debatable.

So, to sum up the last five albums include two of the most successful of U2's career. Another that was indeed successful at least for the year it was released, and only the last two that could be argued as flops.

None of the songs do well on the radio or streaming?!

So, The Best Thing and GOOYOW are not on the radio anytime I turn it on and they don't have near 20 million and 10 million streams on Spotify?

Right OK, my radio must come from a parallel universe and Spotify is lying to me.

Damn you Spotify!!
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: skelter on February 08, 2018, 10:19:53 AM
So depressive. A reason for me to be depressed in my non-real life.

This is like post 360 tour when Bono was bleating on about "why would anyone want another U2 album". Thought in mid-2011 I would read the band had split.

But the soi finally came out 3 years later🤣
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: wons on February 08, 2018, 12:33:29 PM
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We also need to take into account LMJ's back issue, he is not getting any younger.

If he does decide to call it quits then we have to respect him.

in hindsight musically U2 are going nowhere their last 5 albums have been commercial flops

All That You Can't Leave Behind: sold over 12 million copies worldwide, one of the biggest selling albums of the 00s

How To Dismantle An Atomic Bomb: sold over 10 million copies worldwide,one of the biggest selling albums of the 00s

No Line On The Horizon: 7th biggest selling album of 2009 worldwide

Songs Of Innocence: released for free, but none of the songs do well on radio or streaming so this might be considered a flop

Songs Of Experience: Ok album sales for 2017/2018, but none of songs do well on radio or streaming. Maybe a flop, but debatable.

So, to sum up the last five albums include two of the most successful of U2's career. Another that was indeed successful at least for the year it was released, and only the last two that could be argued as flops.

None of the songs do well on the radio or streaming?!

So, The Best Thing and GOOYOW are not on the radio anytime I turn it on and they don't have near 20 million and 10 million streams on Spotify?

Right OK, my radio must come from a parallel universe and Spotify is lying to me.

Damn you Spotify!!

None of the songs from Songs Of Innocence or Songs Of Experience have cracked the US HOT 100 chart. The last time that happened was when U2 released October. The HOT 100 counts single sales, radio airplay, and streaming in order to determine its chart positions.

When you look at streaming, "Your The Best Thing About Me" only has 10 million streams on youtube. Most hit songs will have between 100 million and 500 million streams. Youtube is a worldwide indicator while the US HOT 100 is obviously only in the United States.
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: BlueSquirrel on February 08, 2018, 02:41:09 PM
Right. Where I am (in Europe), the album seems to do rather well. U2 songs are broadcast daily by several radios. Last time I looked at the charts (about two weeks ago), Songs of experience was at number 5 (international rock / pop releases), and it was voted best rock album of 2017 by Virgin Radio staff. Granted, not all the singles from Songs of innocence did get a lot of airplay. However, Every breaking Wave was a radio favourite.

Really hope Larry won't leave the band. It would be terrible news.

https://www.virginradio.fr/u2-foo-fighters-les-meilleurs-albums-rock-de-2017-selon-la-redac-a633807.html (https://www.virginradio.fr/u2-foo-fighters-les-meilleurs-albums-rock-de-2017-selon-la-redac-a633807.html)
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: summerholly on February 08, 2018, 06:10:38 PM
Where I live I have never heard a SOE song on the radio ever. 
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: dirtdrybonesandstone on February 08, 2018, 06:44:26 PM
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Where I live I have never heard a SOE song on the radio ever. 

I was at the gym Tuesday (Golds Gym) and The Blackout video was playing on the monitors.    Best Thing was playing today.
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: HudsonMoon on February 08, 2018, 07:09:33 PM
GOOYOW plays on wfuv.org public radio in nyc quite often.
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: Luzita on February 08, 2018, 07:33:28 PM
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We also need to take into account LMJ's back issue, he is not getting any younger.

If he does decide to call it quits then we have to respect him.

in hindsight musically U2 are going nowhere their last 5 albums have been commercial flops

All That You Can't Leave Behind: sold over 12 million copies worldwide, one of the biggest selling albums of the 00s

How To Dismantle An Atomic Bomb: sold over 10 million copies worldwide,one of the biggest selling albums of the 00s

No Line On The Horizon: 7th biggest selling album of 2009 worldwide

Songs Of Innocence: released for free, but none of the songs do well on radio or streaming so this might be considered a flop

Songs Of Experience: Ok album sales for 2017/2018, but none of songs do well on radio or streaming. Maybe a flop, but debatable.

So, to sum up the last five albums include two of the most successful of U2's career. Another that was indeed successful at least for the year it was released, and only the last two that could be argued as flops.

None of the songs do well on the radio or streaming?!

So, The Best Thing and GOOYOW are not on the radio anytime I turn it on and they don't have near 20 million and 10 million streams on Spotify?

Right OK, my radio must come from a parallel universe and Spotify is lying to me.

Damn you Spotify!!

None of the songs from Songs Of Innocence or Songs Of Experience have cracked the US HOT 100 chart. The last time that happened was when U2 released October. The HOT 100 counts single sales, radio airplay, and streaming in order to determine its chart positions.

When you look at streaming, "Your The Best Thing About Me" only has 10 million streams on youtube. Most hit songs will have between 100 million and 500 million streams. Youtube is a worldwide indicator while the US HOT 100 is obviously only in the United States.

Based on album sales, which is the most important measure, SOE and SOI are definitely not flops. As I noted before, SOE has already sold over a million copies in the short time since release, and even SOI sold over a million despite being given away for free to half a billion iTunes users.

Youíre right these albums didnít have hit singles in the U.S. or U.K, and that is something different for U2, but it has to be put in perspective. Only a handful of rock acts get to the top of the singles charts anymore, because rock is no longer the dominant musical genre.

Also, as blue squirrel pointed out, U2ís singles still do pretty well in some parts of the world. Thereís a chart called the Euro 200 that uses the same measures as the Billboard Hot 100 but itís for the entire EU. YTBTAM reached #24 on that chart.

And in the U.S., the Hot 100 doesnít tell the whole story. There are many different charts, which correspond to different radio formats. YTBTAM did quite well on some of these, like top 15 on Hot Adult Contemporary, Top 5 on Hot Rock, and #1 on Adult Alternative. And it hung around on these charts for months. That means though it didnít get as much radio play as if it had charted in the Top 40 format, it still got a good bit.


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Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: the_chief on February 09, 2018, 12:12:59 AM
Hit songs have between 100 million and 500 million hits on YouTube?!

OK then.. Does this mean you expect U2 to make more music with Eno and Lanois like Passengers and Pop but, be commercial enough to be like Ed Sheeran, to get those streaming numbers for today's generation?!

Nonsense. Utter nonsense. Cuckoo land pal
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: boom boom on February 09, 2018, 05:31:25 AM
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Where I live I have never heard a SOE song on the radio ever. 
Same here.  All the radio stations ever play is 80's U2, and MW and One from the 90's and BD from the 00's.

It's funny U2 spend soo much time and delaying and delaying albums so they can come up with songs with good melody hooks that they think will get played on the radio, but they never do.

When will they take the hint that radio never will any more and start taking risks again.

I'm not saying that SOE is a bad album but it just doesn't blow your mind and have that WOW factor like U2's 90's work, the last time most of us felt like that.  It' just an OK album.

I actually think Quincy Jones was right when asked if U2 are making great songs anymore, in which he shook his head.
I think U2 are making goods song but not great and good albums but not great anymore.  Occasionally they will have one or two great songs on album but it is few and far between.  The last great epic U2 song, in my book that U2 has made was Moment Of Surrender.

Well there is always hope for the next album that they will try to experiment and take risks in the recording process and not just try to focus on getting hit songs for the radio, which seems to be an obsession.

Getting back to the thread, maybe that is what Larry is feeling, that U2 are just making Ok albums now and not great and may want to retire?


Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: Luzita on February 09, 2018, 06:37:35 AM
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Where I live I have never heard a SOE song on the radio ever. 
Same here.  All the radio stations ever play is 80's U2, and MW and One from the 90's and BD from the 00's.

It's funny U2 spend soo much time and delaying and delaying albums so they can come up with songs with good melody hooks that they think will get played on the radio, but they never do.

When will they take the hint that radio never will any more and start taking risks again.

I'm not saying that SOE is a bad album but it just doesn't blow your mind and have that WOW factor like U2's 90's work, the last time most of us felt like that.  It' just an OK album.

I actually think Quincy Jones was right when asked if U2 are making great songs anymore, in which he shook his head.
I think U2 are making goods song but not great and good albums but not great anymore.  Occasionally they will have one or two great songs on album but it is few and far between.  The last great epic U2 song, in my book that U2 has made was Moment Of Surrender.

Well there is always hope for the next album that they will try to experiment and take risks in the recording process and not just try to focus on getting hit songs for the radio, which seems to be an obsession.

Getting back to the thread, maybe that is what Larry is feeling, that U2 are just making Ok albums now and not great and may want to retire?

The rumor about Larry is false. See my previous post. It came from a ďsatireĒ site.

And itís fine that you like their 90s work the best but you shouldnít try to speak for ďmost of us.Ē Many people even on this forum donít feel that way. And going by sales, although Achtung Baby was more popular than their 2000s work that is not true for their other 90s albums. And nothing is more popular than Joshua Tree.


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Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: Billy Rhythm on February 09, 2018, 07:30:44 AM
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Where I live I have never heard a SOE song on the radio ever. 
Same here.  All the radio stations ever play is 80's U2, and MW and One from the 90's and BD from the 00's.

This applies for where I live in Western Canada as well...  U2 doesn't turn up at all on Top 40 Radio while the older hits still show up on the Classic Rock station...  When I say "Radio", I mean FM on the dial...  I don't stream radio at all...:-)
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: the_chief on February 09, 2018, 10:11:08 AM
Should live in Europe so
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: BlueSquirrel on February 09, 2018, 10:57:58 AM
Possibly, lol !

Songs of Experience has just passed the 100k mark and become Gold in the UK today.
And the website Charts in France claims that it is already Gold in Spain and even Platinum in France.
Moreover, today was the general sale day for the fourth U2 concert in Paris. Nearly all seats were sold out in 10 minutes.... they could add a fifth date, it would be welcome.

https://twitter.com/bpi_music (https://twitter.com/bpi_music)
http://www.chartsinfrance.net/communaute/index.php?/topic/53664-les-chiffres-de-ventes-de-u2/ (http://www.chartsinfrance.net/communaute/index.php?/topic/53664-les-chiffres-de-ventes-de-u2/)
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: wons on February 09, 2018, 07:30:50 PM
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Where I live I have never heard a SOE song on the radio ever. 

I was at the gym Tuesday (Golds Gym) and The Blackout video was playing on the monitors.    Best Thing was playing today.

They played the remix version of the Best Thing at my gym. But in general these our tough times for U2 in getting their new music on the radio or noticed on other formats.
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: wons on February 09, 2018, 08:08:50 PM
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We also need to take into account LMJ's back issue, he is not getting any younger.

If he does decide to call it quits then we have to respect him.

in hindsight musically U2 are going nowhere their last 5 albums have been commercial flops

All That You Can't Leave Behind: sold over 12 million copies worldwide, one of the biggest selling albums of the 00s

How To Dismantle An Atomic Bomb: sold over 10 million copies worldwide,one of the biggest selling albums of the 00s

No Line On The Horizon: 7th biggest selling album of 2009 worldwide

Songs Of Innocence: released for free, but none of the songs do well on radio or streaming so this might be considered a flop

Songs Of Experience: Ok album sales for 2017/2018, but none of songs do well on radio or streaming. Maybe a flop, but debatable.

So, to sum up the last five albums include two of the most successful of U2's career. Another that was indeed successful at least for the year it was released, and only the last two that could be argued as flops.

None of the songs do well on the radio or streaming?!

So, The Best Thing and GOOYOW are not on the radio anytime I turn it on and they don't have near 20 million and 10 million streams on Spotify?

Right OK, my radio must come from a parallel universe and Spotify is lying to me.

Damn you Spotify!!

None of the songs from Songs Of Innocence or Songs Of Experience have cracked the US HOT 100 chart. The last time that happened was when U2 released October. The HOT 100 counts single sales, radio airplay, and streaming in order to determine its chart positions.

When you look at streaming, "Your The Best Thing About Me" only has 10 million streams on youtube. Most hit songs will have between 100 million and 500 million streams. Youtube is a worldwide indicator while the US HOT 100 is obviously only in the United States.

Based on album sales, which is the most important measure, SOE and SOI are definitely not flops. As I noted before, SOE has already sold over a million copies in the short time since release, and even SOI sold over a million despite being given away for free to half a billion iTunes users.

Youíre right these albums didnít have hit singles in the U.S. or U.K, and that is something different for U2, but it has to be put in perspective. Only a handful of rock acts get to the top of the singles charts anymore, because rock is no longer the dominant musical genre.

Also, as blue squirrel pointed out, U2ís singles still do pretty well in some parts of the world. Thereís a chart called the Euro 200 that uses the same measures as the Billboard Hot 100 but itís for the entire EU. YTBTAM reached #24 on that chart.

And in the U.S., the Hot 100 doesnít tell the whole story. There are many different charts, which correspond to different radio formats. YTBTAM did quite well on some of these, like top 15 on Hot Adult Contemporary, Top 5 on Hot Rock, and #1 on Adult Alternative. And it hung around on these charts for months. That means though it didnít get as much radio play as if it had charted in the Top 40 format, it still got a good bit.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Those other charts in the United States are used to help compile chart positions on the HOT 100. Adult Contemporary, HOT Rock, and Adult Alternative are all used along with dozens of other formats to help determine chart positions on the HOT 100.

In a very narrow sense you may be able to judge the Albums Songs of Innocence and Songs Of Experience as not being flops. But most people stream new music these days and these stream individual songs, not albums. They purchase individual digital tracks, but that is actually declining now.

It used to be up until the start of this decade, that to know whether your new music was doing well, you looked at how the album with the new music is selling. I'd say in 2018, that is only 20% of the equation when it used to be nearly 100% back in 2000.

To see if your new music is doing well now, you look at streaming, probably 60%, then individual digital track sales another 20%, and then finally album sales both physical and digital making up the remaining 20%.

U2 still does ok with album sales compared with everyone else, but their streaming numbers and individual digital track sales are poor. So when I say that the albums SOI and SOE have flopped, what I'm really saying is that the music on them has flopped.

Sadly, albums are starting to become something special that only hardcore fans purchase and that goes for probably 95% of artist. There are a few exceptions, but only handful.

U2 are album artist, probably the greatest album artist of all time, but sadly the music environment has moved and continues to move away from the album format, physical or digital. Most people are just streaming SONGS they like on youtube or paying the $10 dollar monthly fee to have unlimited streaming on spotify.

For example a good run down for popular new music might be Imagine Dragons.

Their album, Evolve, sold 400,000 copies in the United States, one of the 20 biggest sellers in the USA of the year.

More important though is the two hit singles from the album Evolve:
Believer: has sold over 1 million digital copies in the United States
Thunder: has sold over 1 million digital copies in the United States
Both songs made it to #4 on the HOT 100.

On Youtube:
Thunder: 532 million streams
Believer: 446 million streams


By Comparison, Songs Of Experience has around 280,000 copies sold in the United States at this point.
You're The Best Thing About Me as a single has not sold very much, probably less than 100,000 digital singles in the USA. Failed to chart on the HOT 100, and the highest position in other countries was #24 in France. In most it did not crack the top 50.
Get Out of Your Own Way is doing worse

Youtube:
You're The Best Thing About Me: about 16 million streams on youtube.
Get Out of Your Own Way has 1.2 million streams.

The big problem is that have good album sales is not enough. Good album sales today might be 400,000 in the USA and 1.5 million worldwide. That's good, but if that is all there is in terms of what people have obtained of the new music, then that is not good for the new music. It suggest that the new music only reached dedicated fans that have been following the band for years or decades.

I should note though that these days popularity is getting harder to measure. So a lot of this is estimated because it really is a new world were in when it comes to music and how people listen to it and what they prefer. Sadly though, the album is viewed as a dying format and no longer the gauge of popularity that it used to be.

I'm an album lover though, and believe the best artist are the ones that produce albums that are great from the first song to the last song as opposed to just two or three and having the rest as filler. But as you know, what is best is not always what is popular.
Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: summerholly on February 09, 2018, 08:29:46 PM
It is interesting.  I am not really into their new music in that I don't buy it but they are still one of the few bands in the world for whom I would make the considerable effort needed for me to get to a concert if they ever came here.  As long as the ticket prices were not too exorbitant. 
Title: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: Luzita on February 09, 2018, 11:24:21 PM
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We also need to take into account LMJ's back issue, he is not getting any younger.

If he does decide to call it quits then we have to respect him.

in hindsight musically U2 are going nowhere their last 5 albums have been commercial flops

All That You Can't Leave Behind: sold over 12 million copies worldwide, one of the biggest selling albums of the 00s

How To Dismantle An Atomic Bomb: sold over 10 million copies worldwide,one of the biggest selling albums of the 00s

No Line On The Horizon: 7th biggest selling album of 2009 worldwide

Songs Of Innocence: released for free, but none of the songs do well on radio or streaming so this might be considered a flop

Songs Of Experience: Ok album sales for 2017/2018, but none of songs do well on radio or streaming. Maybe a flop, but debatable.

So, to sum up the last five albums include two of the most successful of U2's career. Another that was indeed successful at least for the year it was released, and only the last two that could be argued as flops.

None of the songs do well on the radio or streaming?!

So, The Best Thing and GOOYOW are not on the radio anytime I turn it on and they don't have near 20 million and 10 million streams on Spotify?

Right OK, my radio must come from a parallel universe and Spotify is lying to me.

Damn you Spotify!!

None of the songs from Songs Of Innocence or Songs Of Experience have cracked the US HOT 100 chart. The last time that happened was when U2 released October. The HOT 100 counts single sales, radio airplay, and streaming in order to determine its chart positions.

When you look at streaming, "Your The Best Thing About Me" only has 10 million streams on youtube. Most hit songs will have between 100 million and 500 million streams. Youtube is a worldwide indicator while the US HOT 100 is obviously only in the United States.

Based on album sales, which is the most important measure, SOE and SOI are definitely not flops. As I noted before, SOE has already sold over a million copies in the short time since release, and even SOI sold over a million despite being given away for free to half a billion iTunes users.

Youíre right these albums didnít have hit singles in the U.S. or U.K, and that is something different for U2, but it has to be put in perspective. Only a handful of rock acts get to the top of the singles charts anymore, because rock is no longer the dominant musical genre.

Also, as blue squirrel pointed out, U2ís singles still do pretty well in some parts of the world. Thereís a chart called the Euro 200 that uses the same measures as the Billboard Hot 100 but itís for the entire EU. YTBTAM reached #24 on that chart.

And in the U.S., the Hot 100 doesnít tell the whole story. There are many different charts, which correspond to different radio formats. YTBTAM did quite well on some of these, like top 15 on Hot Adult Contemporary, Top 5 on Hot Rock, and #1 on Adult Alternative. And it hung around on these charts for months. That means though it didnít get as much radio play as if it had charted in the Top 40 format, it still got a good bit.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Those other charts in the United States are used to help compile chart positions on the HOT 100. Adult Contemporary, HOT Rock, and Adult Alternative are all used along with dozens of other formats to help determine chart positions on the HOT 100.

In a very narrow sense you may be able to judge the Albums Songs of Innocence and Songs Of Experience as not being flops. But most people stream new music these days and these stream individual songs, not albums. They purchase individual digital tracks, but that is actually declining now.

It used to be up until the start of this decade, that to know whether your new music was doing well, you looked at how the album with the new music is selling. I'd say in 2018, that is only 20% of the equation when it used to be nearly 100% back in 2000.

To see if your new music is doing well now, you look at streaming, probably 60%, then individual digital track sales another 20%, and then finally album sales both physical and digital making up the remaining 20%.

U2 still does ok with album sales compared with everyone else, but their streaming numbers and individual digital track sales are poor. So when I say that the albums SOI and SOE have flopped, what I'm really saying is that the music on them has flopped.

Sadly, albums are starting to become something special that only hardcore fans purchase and that goes for probably 95% of artist. There are a few exceptions, but only handful.

U2 are album artist, probably the greatest album artist of all time, but sadly the music environment has moved and continues to move away from the album format, physical or digital. Most people are just streaming SONGS they like on youtube or paying the $10 dollar monthly fee to have unlimited streaming on spotify.

For example a good run down for popular new music might be Imagine Dragons.

Their album, Evolve, sold 400,000 copies in the United States, one of the 20 biggest sellers in the USA of the year.

More important though is the two hit singles from the album Evolve:
Believer: has sold over 1 million digital copies in the United States
Thunder: has sold over 1 million digital copies in the United States
Both songs made it to #4 on the HOT 100.

On Youtube:
Thunder: 532 million streams
Believer: 446 million streams


By Comparison, Songs Of Experience has around 280,000 copies sold in the United States at this point.
You're The Best Thing About Me as a single has not sold very much, probably less than 100,000 digital singles in the USA. Failed to chart on the HOT 100, and the highest position in other countries was #24 in France. In most it did not crack the top 50.
Get Out of Your Own Way is doing worse

Youtube:
You're The Best Thing About Me: about 16 million streams on youtube.
Get Out of Your Own Way has 1.2 million streams.

The big problem is that have good album sales is not enough. Good album sales today might be 400,000 in the USA and 1.5 million worldwide. That's good, but if that is all there is in terms of what people have obtained of the new music, then that is not good for the new music. It suggest that the new music only reached dedicated fans that have been following the band for years or decades.

I should note though that these days popularity is getting harder to measure. So a lot of this is estimated because it really is a new world were in when it comes to music and how people listen to it and what they prefer. Sadly though, the album is viewed as a dying format and no longer the gauge of popularity that it used to be.

I'm an album lover though, and believe the best artist are the ones that produce albums that are great from the first song to the last song as opposed to just two or three and having the rest as filler. But as you know, what is best is not always what is popular.

You make some good points. And you seem to have some good data; thanks for that. Itís true album sales would be mostly due to established fans, whereas streaming would be a better indicator of whether the music is reaching new people, esp. younger people. I know U2 would like to expand their fanbase.

On the other hand, in terms of getting paid for your music, how much does streaming do for an artist? Iíve heard they get very little for it. Maybe you understand this better as you seem to know a lot about the music business. I mean, even though it takes a lot of streams to be considered equivalent to an album sale, is it really equivalent in terms of financial compensation to the artist? Iíve wondered where the money would come from for free streaming. I guess from advertising.

Also, when speaking of album sales, it gets a bit confusing because streaming and digital singles are now bundled into the album sales figure. So in the case of Imagine Dragons, wouldnít a lot of that 400,000 be due to something other than actual album sales?

Imagine Dragons is a good example of a ďrockĒ artist that still does well in terms of singles sales, but there arenít many. As I mentioned before, I think the decline in popularity of rock as a genre is a barrier to U2 getting their music noticed by the general public especially young people.




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Title: Re: Larry to retire after the e+I tour?
Post by: wons on February 10, 2018, 12:14:40 AM
Quote
On the other hand, in terms of getting paid for your music, how much does streaming do for an artist?


Its pretty bad. I think it takes hundreds of streams just to see 1 cent. For Spotify I think it might be a little better because subscribers are paying $10 dollars a month. But Spotify gets paid first, then the artist based on how much their stuff streams. Its not very good. Its one reason I think why you see less rock bands out there. Its so much more difficult now to make money from recorded music. Once some money makes it back to the band, then they have to split that money among four or five people in the band.

Quote
Also, when speaking of album sales, it gets a bit confusing because streaming and digital singles are now bundled into the album sales figure. So in the case of Imagine Dragons, wouldnít a lot of that 400,000 be due to something other than actual album sales?


The RIAA which certifies albums as Gold, Platinum and multi-platinum started letting streams and individual track sales count towards overall album sales in 2015.

The above figure for the Imagine Dragons album is a soundscan figure of just the physical and digital albums sold. So no streams, or individual track sales are included in that. Its a raw album sales figure.

But as you can see, the raw album sales figures are not that high by any standard. All the volume is in the streams and digital track sales. Plus, there are obviously ways, like file sharing or even CD burning, or other methods where people obtain music for free which is not even tracked. But the streaming and individual track sales that are tracked probably gives a good idea of what is popular.

Its just shocking that what was still the chief gauge of what was popular even 10 years ago, the album and its sales, has been pushed far to the back.

Rock music an especially rock bands have really been hit hard. You don't find many any more on the HOT 100 or the Billboard 200 in any given week. Hip Hop, R&B, Rap, Dance, general Pop, Country are what the masses seem to be listening to.

Plus, when we talk about rock that is one thing. But Hard Rock or Heavy Metal share of everything is even worse. Soft Rock or Pop/Rock has the best chance of cracking the charts from the ROCK Genre these days.