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U2 => The Band => Topic started by: bonoman816 on October 02, 2009, 05:15:40 PM

Title: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: bonoman816 on October 02, 2009, 05:15:40 PM
 >:( recently an (ex) friend was in a rage when he found out i liked u2 cuz he said bono was a total hypocrite and hasnt donated a single penny to charity. anyone know where i can find something to prove him worng? i know ive read about him giving lots to charities, so it cant be too hard to find. Thanks! ;)

PS i missed the forum so much! how have u guys been?
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: ElJayVee on October 02, 2009, 05:24:44 PM
Welcome back, Bonoman!

Grrr.  I know how you feel.  I defend our guy to so many people, but I've never looked for supporting evidence.  I think the fact that he travels to the corners of the earth to meet with leaders and shame them into giving more aid irks some people.  I also know that tax advantages of charitable donations are great, so with the income he makes, he's bound to donate a big chunk of change to decrease his tax bill.  That's the argument I like to use.  Talk to any accountant!
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: bonoman816 on October 02, 2009, 05:30:39 PM
Haha very true! thanks 8) just found this- which does make him look pretty darn good ;D ;D

http://www.looktothestars.org/celebrity/26-bono
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: Belisama on October 02, 2009, 05:33:33 PM
I'll chime in on this. Bono cannot win in this situation. If he does donate money and makes it public, people will say he is trying to buy his way into heaven. I personally feel that it is his own business. I will point out that outside of any money he does or doesn't donate all his charity work takes time away from music, touring, etc where he could be making 5 times the money he is currently making. I look at that as part of the money he donates to charity. He may donate money but he definitely donates a more precious resource-- his time.  
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: StrongGirl on October 02, 2009, 05:36:48 PM
Yes Beli, I agree with you. He gives a lot of his time which is priceless!
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: u2yooper on October 02, 2009, 07:28:28 PM
I admire the fact that he keeps his charity donations, whatever they may be, private  He could easily be writing big, public checks, but that would put the focus on him and not his cause.  He knows full well the beating he takes, and has the grace to joke about it.  He remains undeterred in pursuing what he thinks are just causes.  Beli is right that he cannot win.  And I don't think his personal gain is his goal.  (Where you been, Bonoman.  Welcome back!)
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: Monicalea on October 02, 2009, 07:38:38 PM
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Yes Beli, I agree with you. He gives a lot of his time which is priceless!

And speaking as someone who acts as an actual volunteer coordinator, not only is it priceless it's much more valuable than cash!
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: 1985 on October 05, 2009, 08:40:20 AM
I would refute by saying:

1. none of us has any idea how much of his wealth, if any, he gives away. And it's not really our business.

2. he's taken no vow of poverty. Quite the opposite, his standard line is that he'd vastly prefer being a decadent rock star (even if I suspect he's being cheeky when he says this). He openly enjoys his wealth, without apologies. He's no more a hypocrite for this than Bill Gates is for continuing to hang on to a few of his (once) tens of billions in wealth. Gates is an amazing human being for the same reasons that Bono is -- they're involved in these issues deeply, beyond any personal contribution.

3. when it comes to his most prominent cause, he's the first to say that charity is ineffective -- it's not money per se, it's policy, priorities, etc, that will ultimately make for a more just world. Governments collect taxes, period; the question is, how will those revenues be redistributed? For defense purposes? For corporate welfare? For subsidies that make us (in rich countries) lazy and content while locking out international competition? Or will rich countries see the benefit of enlightened self-interest -- will see that festering poverty, no matter how far away, threatens our security (for those who need practical rather than moral reasons to act). Will governments recognize that we've invested successfully in developing nations before -- so why not decently governed African nations now?

4. the impact of his efforts, his time, his persuasive ability, his wonkishness, his lobbying, etc, on behalf of the poorest of the poor are undeniable. With lots of smart, talented people around him, debt has been forgiven, aid for highly preventable and curable diseases has skyrocketed by the billions, drug treatments by the millions have been distributed, kids have gone to school -- all with Bono as the world's most prominent lobbyist.

There are a number of articles in sources such as the New York Times, Time Magazine, and others that detail the extent of Bono's political and policy involvement and his effectiveness as a strategist and negotiator, not just a figurehead.

I think it's appropriate and in Bono's best interest for there to be skepticism -- skepticism heightens personal accountability. Since Bono has created this role of humantarian for himself, he does have a higher standard. But I don't think the "hypocrisy" angle around his charitable giving is a successful line of attack. A more interesting, but subtle area of inquiry is whether Bono's campaigns have put enough focus on the tougher nuts to crack -- like truly opening up trade and creating a level playing field. Or whether these campaigns generate disproportionately negative views of Africa, which help perpetuate the cycles. Or whether there's enough focus on the Accountability issue (which is the second "A" in DATA). All these areas are worth a rich discussion. But the easy, FOXNEWS / Talk Radio style gotcha / outrage journalism really holds no water.



Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: U2Pride on October 05, 2009, 06:55:28 PM
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Yes Beli, I agree with you. He gives a lot of his time which is priceless!

And speaking as someone who acts as an actual volunteer coordinator, not only is it priceless it's much more valuable than cash!

I also agree with this. We may not know how much money he has or hasn't donated. But we do know that he cares enough take the time to help others in need. Which is very important.

Hi Bam <3  :)
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: EdgeFest [Zenmaster360] on October 05, 2009, 07:34:14 PM
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I would refute by saying:

1. none of us has any idea how much of his wealth, if any, he gives away. And it's not really our business.

2. he's taken no vow of poverty. Quite the opposite, his standard line is that he'd vastly prefer being a decadent rock star (even if I suspect he's being cheeky when he says this). He openly enjoys his wealth, without apologies. He's no more a hypocrite for this than Bill Gates is for continuing to hang on to a few of his (once) tens of billions in wealth. Gates is an amazing human being for the same reasons that Bono is -- they're involved in these issues deeply, beyond any personal contribution.

3. when it comes to his most prominent cause, he's the first to say that charity is ineffective -- it's not money per se, it's policy, priorities, etc, that will ultimately make for a more just world. Governments collect taxes, period; the question is, how will those revenues be redistributed? For defense purposes? For corporate welfare? For subsidies that make us (in rich countries) lazy and content while locking out international competition? Or will rich countries see the benefit of enlightened self-interest -- will see that festering poverty, no matter how far away, threatens our security (for those who need practical rather than moral reasons to act). Will governments recognize that we've invested successfully in developing nations before -- so why not decently governed African nations now?

4. the impact of his efforts, his time, his persuasive ability, his wonkishness, his lobbying, etc, on behalf of the poorest of the poor are undeniable. With lots of smart, talented people around him, debt has been forgiven, aid for highly preventable and curable diseases has skyrocketed by the billions, drug treatments by the millions have been distributed, kids have gone to school -- all with Bono as the world's most prominent lobbyist.

There are a number of articles in sources such as the New York Times, Time Magazine, and others that detail the extent of Bono's political and policy involvement and his effectiveness as a strategist and negotiator, not just a figurehead.

I think it's appropriate and in Bono's best interest for there to be skepticism -- skepticism heightens personal accountability. Since Bono has created this role of humantarian for himself, he does have a higher standard. But I don't think the "hypocrisy" angle around his charitable giving is a successful line of attack. A more interesting, but subtle area of inquiry is whether Bono's campaigns have put enough focus on the tougher nuts to crack -- like truly opening up trade and creating a level playing field. Or whether these campaigns generate disproportionately negative views of Africa, which help perpetuate the cycles. Or whether there's enough focus on the Accountability issue (which is the second "A" in DATA). All these areas are worth a rich discussion. But the easy, FOXNEWS / Talk Radio style gotcha / outrage journalism really holds no water.





YES!!! Excellent.

bonoman - just get 1985 on the phone, your friend would clearly lose the argument :D
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: Rock N Roll Girl on October 05, 2009, 10:27:01 PM
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I would refute by saying:

1. none of us has any idea how much of his wealth, if any, he gives away. And it's not really our business.

2. he's taken no vow of poverty. Quite the opposite, his standard line is that he'd vastly prefer being a decadent rock star (even if I suspect he's being cheeky when he says this). He openly enjoys his wealth, without apologies. He's no more a hypocrite for this than Bill Gates is for continuing to hang on to a few of his (once) tens of billions in wealth. Gates is an amazing human being for the same reasons that Bono is -- they're involved in these issues deeply, beyond any personal contribution.

3. when it comes to his most prominent cause, he's the first to say that charity is ineffective -- it's not money per se, it's policy, priorities, etc, that will ultimately make for a more just world. Governments collect taxes, period; the question is, how will those revenues be redistributed? For defense purposes? For corporate welfare? For subsidies that make us (in rich countries) lazy and content while locking out international competition? Or will rich countries see the benefit of enlightened self-interest -- will see that festering poverty, no matter how far away, threatens our security (for those who need practical rather than moral reasons to act). Will governments recognize that we've invested successfully in developing nations before -- so why not decently governed African nations now?

4. the impact of his efforts, his time, his persuasive ability, his wonkishness, his lobbying, etc, on behalf of the poorest of the poor are undeniable. With lots of smart, talented people around him, debt has been forgiven, aid for highly preventable and curable diseases has skyrocketed by the billions, drug treatments by the millions have been distributed, kids have gone to school -- all with Bono as the world's most prominent lobbyist.

There are a number of articles in sources such as the New York Times, Time Magazine, and others that detail the extent of Bono's political and policy involvement and his effectiveness as a strategist and negotiator, not just a figurehead.

I think it's appropriate and in Bono's best interest for there to be skepticism -- skepticism heightens personal accountability. Since Bono has created this role of humantarian for himself, he does have a higher standard. But I don't think the "hypocrisy" angle around his charitable giving is a successful line of attack. A more interesting, but subtle area of inquiry is whether Bono's campaigns have put enough focus on the tougher nuts to crack -- like truly opening up trade and creating a level playing field. Or whether these campaigns generate disproportionately negative views of Africa, which help perpetuate the cycles. Or whether there's enough focus on the Accountability issue (which is the second "A" in DATA). All these areas are worth a rich discussion. But the easy, FOXNEWS / Talk Radio style gotcha / outrage journalism really holds no water.




Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: Rock N Roll Girl on October 05, 2009, 10:29:03 PM
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I would refute by saying:

1. none of us has any idea how much of his wealth, if any, he gives away. And it's not really our business.

2. he's taken no vow of poverty. Quite the opposite, his standard line is that he'd vastly prefer being a decadent rock star (even if I suspect he's being cheeky when he says this). He openly enjoys his wealth, without apologies. He's no more a hypocrite for this than Bill Gates is for continuing to hang on to a few of his (once) tens of billions in wealth. Gates is an amazing human being for the same reasons that Bono is -- they're involved in these issues deeply, beyond any personal contribution.

3. when it comes to his most prominent cause, he's the first to say that charity is ineffective -- it's not money per se, it's policy, priorities, etc, that will ultimately make for a more just world. Governments collect taxes, period; the question is, how will those revenues be redistributed? For defense purposes? For corporate welfare? For subsidies that make us (in rich countries) lazy and content while locking out international competition? Or will rich countries see the benefit of enlightened self-interest -- will see that festering poverty, no matter how far away, threatens our security (for those who need practical rather than moral reasons to act). Will governments recognize that we've invested successfully in developing nations before -- so why not decently governed African nations now?

4. the impact of his efforts, his time, his persuasive ability, his wonkishness, his lobbying, etc, on behalf of the poorest of the poor are undeniable. With lots of smart, talented people around him, debt has been forgiven, aid for highly preventable and curable diseases has skyrocketed by the billions, drug treatments by the millions have been distributed, kids have gone to school -- all with Bono as the world's most prominent lobbyist.

There are a number of articles in sources such as the New York Times, Time Magazine, and others that detail the extent of Bono's political and policy involvement and his effectiveness as a strategist and negotiator, not just a figurehead.

I think it's appropriate and in Bono's best interest for there to be skepticism -- skepticism heightens personal accountability. Since Bono has created this role of humantarian for himself, he does have a higher standard. But I don't think the "hypocrisy" angle around his charitable giving is a successful line of attack. A more interesting, but subtle area of inquiry is whether Bono's campaigns have put enough focus on the tougher nuts to crack -- like truly opening up trade and creating a level playing field. Or whether these campaigns generate disproportionately negative views of Africa, which help perpetuate the cycles. Or whether there's enough focus on the Accountability issue (which is the second "A" in DATA). All these areas are worth a rich discussion. But the easy, FOXNEWS / Talk Radio style gotcha / outrage journalism really holds no water.





Oops! I am a dork and hit the wrong button - sorry about that! I meant to say - this is a well thought out post and pretty much covers it. Thanks!
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: bonoman816 on October 20, 2009, 12:11:32 AM
thank you all so much! 1985, i emailed that to my friend...and we have talked since...victory!! ;D ;D

now i need advice on what to bring to the rose bowl concert to get on the dvd... :D :D

hiya pride! ;D <3
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: U2Pride on October 21, 2009, 04:47:27 PM
Yay good job Bam!!! Pffft, no one calls Bono a hypocrite without getting something from the forum  ;D

<3 <3  :)
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: Belisama on October 21, 2009, 04:51:42 PM
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thank you all so much! 1985, i emailed that to my friend...and we have talked since...victory!! ;D ;D

now i need advice on what to bring to the rose bowl concert to get on the dvd... :D :D

hiya pride! ;D <3

Judging from what I have seen from the shows so far: An American Flag or a 10 year old brother or nephew.
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: U2Pride on October 21, 2009, 04:53:10 PM
BRING ONE OF THE MANY LITTLE KIDS THAT ARE ALWAYS AT YOUR HOUSE!  :D
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: Monicalea on October 21, 2009, 06:42:14 PM
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BRING ONE OF THE MANY LITTLE KIDS THAT ARE ALWAYS AT YOUR HOUSE!  :D

Yep, or as I like to call them, Bono Bait.
Title: Re: OH NO! Horrible things said about Bono must be refuted-please help!
Post by: bonoman816 on October 21, 2009, 08:15:33 PM
haha do u think i could sneak em in? :D

or i cud get my dad to give up his ticket... ;D